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Topic: Tchaikovsky, A remarkably good value CD package< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
Alan D Offline




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Posted: Mar. 05 2007, 04:28

It's a long, long time since I last listened to Tchaikovsky - he was never a particular favourite, so I never replaced my LPs with CDs when the time came. But recently I found I had a wish to hear those astonishing, unforgettable opening notes of the 4th symphony again, representing Fate knocking at the door. (If you know it, you'll know what I mean; if you don't, then I promise it's worth a listen.) So I browsed around on Amazon looking for a cheap good recording of the 4th symphony ... but then I found this:

Amazing bargain box set of Tchaikovsky symphonies and more

For under £9, you get a box of 6 CDs. This gives you ALL the symphonies (6 of them), plus the Manfred symphony, Capriccio Italien, Eugene Onegin, Serenade for Strings, The Tempest, & Romeo and Juliet besides. In fact each CD is crammed full of stuff, amounting to a total of over 7 hours of music - all modern high quality recordings by Andrew Litton and the Bournemouth Symphony Orchestra. The performances are certainly enjoyable from what I've heard so far. They are virtually giving all this music away, at less than £1.50 per disc, and it comes in a nice, robust package too.

Well, I am having a Tchaikovsky-fest. Fate has been knocking at my door once again, with a welcome revisit from the fourth symphony, and I never did listen to the first three symphonies before, so now's my chance. Maybe yours too?
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Ugo Offline




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Posted: Mar. 05 2007, 17:16

Please forgive me for the huge inappropriateness of this reply of mine, Alan, but I usually don't buy this kind of bargain-priced packages, because in most cases the performers (orchestras, conductors etc.) are not well-known, and this gets me away from that kind of sets. Yes, certainly I know that little-known orchestras & conductors may be able to play just as good as big-name ones, and maybe even better than them, but my view on this (especially in the field of classical music) is that there surely must be a reason why James Levine (to name just one) is more famous than Andrew Litton. :D So I normally get those packages only when I feel the need to complete my collection of works by one particular composer, e.g. Dvorak: I bought an excellent edition of all his symphonies on an excellent label, Naxos. The performers are not well-known but the label is - as one of the best classical labels. :D In every other case, I tend to stay away from this kind of things.

OK, back on topic: I have all of Tchaikovsky's 6 symphonies, performed by Claudio Abbado with the Berliner Philarmoniker. My favourite is the sixth, maybe the best-known one of the group, but I really love them all. :)


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Alan D Offline




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Posted: Mar. 05 2007, 18:03

Quote (Ugo @ Mar. 05 2007, 22:16)
I usually don't buy this kind of bargain-priced packages, because in most cases the performers (orchestras, conductors etc.) are not well-known, and this gets me away from that kind of sets.

Not inappropriate at all, Ugo, but an interesting discussion.

I think my experience must have been very different to yours with sets like this. The most striking example is the wonderful boxed set of Elgar's major orchestral works conducted by Leonard Slatkin and the St Louis Symphony Orchestra. I'm a lifelong devotee of Elgar, and wouldn't be able to tolerate poor performances of Elgar's symphonies - but this set is incredibly cheap, yet really worth having, even though I own lots of other recordings of these chief works.

I'm not familiar enough with Tchaikovsky's symphonies after such a long gap of time to be able to say how these Litton performances stand up next to the competition; it may well be that eventually I'll need to try for something better. I can't say. But for now, to be able to re-acquaint myself with the music like this, they're invaluable to me. I'm quite sure it's possible to pay a lot more and get far poorer performances than these.
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Alan D Offline




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Posted: Mar. 06 2007, 03:57

I was interrupted last night when I wrote the above, though I had a couple more things to say:

It seems that I'm doing things in the opposite order to you, Ugo. Because I'm effectively starting with nothing, this set allows me to re-establish an overview of Tchaikovsky so that I can then decide which symphonies (if any) I want to investigate further, with other recordings. Heck, I've had my money's worth out of it already.

Incidentally, another bargain box that's worth having is the Naxos white box of Sibelius symphonies, with the Iceland Symphony orchestra under Petri Sakari. I see you mention Naxos in your post, and I agree their recordings are often excellent value. I think I'd describe their Sibelius set as workmanlike and effective rather than dazzling (probably in the same league as this Tchaikovsky set in fact), but eminently listenable and a financially painless way of owning a big slab of Finnish genius.
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moonchildhippy Offline




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Posted: Mar. 06 2007, 18:43

How I wish I wasn't out of work, bloody government expect me to  live on £57.45 a week Jobseekers Allowance   :( . Sent off 3 job apps today, started writing a fourth. Sorry guess I'd better stop there before it turns into a rant about this Blair Government.  It's just having to exist on JSA allows ya no little pleasures in life.

I often get a bit confused with buying classical recordings, about what would be of  good quality. £9 for 6 Tchaikovsky recordings sounds a very good price, and as Alan says is "eminently listenable".  I bought some Elgar and also Vaughan Williams CDs on the HMV label, I gather these are sold exclusively by the HMV chain shops/website.  My next classical purchase(when I get some money)  is to buy some Wagner, only have some on an old worn out casette. Like to take some classical musicto play in the car occasionally. Dammit my 6 multiplay   CD player has gone wrong, and the CD loader wopn't eject. So have to play tapes, no Mike either as haveMike's music  on LP or CD. Must be these bumpy uneven roads round here. Hit a bump at 20-30 mph it frequently causes CD to jump. Strange how I didn't notice any bumpy uneven road surfaces in rural Herefordshire/Wales  :) .  I hate being stuck in Bedfordshire.

Sorry for rants above  :O .  BTW I thought Tchaicovsky was Russian not Finnish.


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Alan D Offline




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Posted: Mar. 07 2007, 04:14

Quote (moonchildhippy @ Mar. 06 2007, 23:43)
BTW I thought Tchaicovsky was Russian not Finnish.

Dammit I just wrote a huge post in reply to yours, then accidentally deleted it all. I'll do it again later.

However in the meantime, yes, Tchaikovsky was Russian, but Sibelius was Finnish - and in that last paragraph I'd slipped off into a discussion of a Sibelius box set.
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Ugo Offline




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Posted: Mar. 07 2007, 06:59

Going off-topic again, ain't we, Alan? :D

Joking aside, I have two Sibelius boxes: a 3-CD box by DG entitled "Symphonic Poems", which is just that :) and it's ab-fab, and another box by Naxos - maybe the same one as you, Alan? I don't remember the title, mine is 6 CDs and I don't think that the orchestra & director are the ones you mention. However, it's fantastic stuff as well. Very non-classical music - which is kind of paradoxical for something that's usually labelled as classical! ;) I mean: it doesn't sound of its time, it sounds very contemporary; most of it sounds like film scores/soundtracks to my ears. And this is meant as a compliment :D because I just love orchestra-based film scores.


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Alan D Offline




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Posted: Mar. 07 2007, 08:16

Quote (Ugo @ Mar. 07 2007, 11:59)
Going off-topic again, ain't we, Alan?

Yes - and see how our transgressions make us pay in the end? We cause confusion and disturb the peace!

It sounds as though we have different Naxos Sibelius sets - mine is 5 CDs in a white box (seems not to be available now). I do agree entirely with your about the up-to-dateness of Sibelius, Ugo; he always come up fresh and bright, as if it was written and recorded yesterday, or even this morning!

Joking aside, I think this is pretty much on-topic actually, because I think the idea of buying the Tchaikovsky set in particular does raise the whole issue of box sets in general as an important part of the decision 'to buy or not to buy'. So I say we carry on regardless.
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Alan D Offline




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Posted: Mar. 07 2007, 08:39

Quote (moonchildhippy @ Mar. 06 2007, 23:43)
I often get a bit confused with buying classical recordings, about what would be of  good quality.

OK let me see if I can remember what I wrote (and accidentally deleted) earlier.

I think there are two over-riding issues - recording quality, and performance. These days it seems a rare thing to find actually poor recordings - I mean technically poor recording quality. Even the bottom line seems to be listenable. The situation is very different to how it was, say, in the 60s and 70s, when many older mono (and perfectly acceptable) classical recordings were reissued as 'reprocessed stereo' - and they sounded absolutely dire! One can argue about the pros and cons of different miking techniques, and how well the acoustic of the hall is preserved, and the depth of the virtual sound stage - but I don't think I've bought a single classical recording in the last ten years that wasn't at least adequate in a technical recording sense.

When it comes to assessing the actual performance, it's much more difficult. The reviews on Amazon are very subjective, and taken one at a time, of limited value. But if you get say 5 or more reviews all saying similar things about the performance, then that's a pretty good guide.

I haven't found that 'star performers' are necessarily the ones to go for. For example, I really, really love Elgar's violin concerto. And Nigel Kennedy is a famous violinist. But his performance of the Elgar concerto, while full of virtuoso fireworks, fails to get at the soul of the music, for me. The Elgar is full of bitter-sweet longing - it is what drives its heart - and Kennedy misses it. By contrast the far less flashy performance by Hugh Bean (available on a bargain label) has me in tears every time.

It's all a bit of a lottery, but to get back to this particular case of the Tchaikovsky set: I've already had my money's worth out of it. Even if at some point in the future I splash out on other (perhaps better) performances, I shall be able to do so from a position of familarity with the works that was made possible through this bargain set.

What particular Wagner are you wanting, Galadriel? Orchestral highlights? The Ring? Tristan? If you're after a 'Ring' highlights CD, I might be able to help.
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moonchildhippy Offline




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Posted: Mar. 07 2007, 18:46

Quote (Alan D @ Mar. 07 2007, 13:39)
Quote (moonchildhippy @ Mar. 06 2007, 23:43)
I often get a bit confused with buying classical recordings, about what would be of  good quality.

OK let me see if I can remember what I wrote (and accidentally deleted) earlier.

I think there are two over-riding issues - recording quality, and performance. These days it seems a rare thing to find actually poor recordings - I mean technically poor recording quality. Even the bottom line seems to be listenable. The situation is very different to how it was, say, in the 60s and 70s, when many older mono (and perfectly acceptable) classical recordings were reissued as 'reprocessed stereo' - and they sounded absolutely dire!

the works that was made possible through this bargain set.

What particular Wagner are you wanting, Galadriel? Orchestral highlights? The Ring? Tristan? If you're after a 'Ring' highlights CD, I might be able to help.

That's so annoying typing then accidentally deleting all your work.

As for recording quality, I don't how much age has to do with it. I would say my oldest LP is "England's Newest Hitmakers" by the Rolling Stones (US pressing of their first album), also have a Vaughan Williams LP Fantasia on Greensleeves, English Folksong Suite, and Fantasia, Thomas Tallis dating from 1965 ,Vienna State Orhestra /Sir Adrian Boult, but recording quality is OK despite being monophonic.

Maybe I'm just a bit more fussy with my listening medium with classical music, as with rock I don't think  hiss is as noticable. Maybe it's down to the quality of vinyl used, I've heard Hergest Ridge described as an "audio fry up" due to the poor quality vinyl, as an oil crisis was on rock and pop records were generally made from the sweepings from the floor. I've never played my LP of Hergest Ridge,as I dont have a turntable at present :O, must be missing out on about 25%of my enitre music collection.  I  mainly play CDs, but sometimes enjoy a  return to LPs from time to time. However I don't feel I could part with my LPs. I guess  there's one song "Doin' Alright"  by Smile which AFAIK was/is only available on a Japanese import LP called "Gettin' Smile" .  For those of you not in the know Smile were formed by Brian May and Roger Taylor of Queen along with bassist Tim Staffell. Doin(g) Allright would later resurface on Queen's debut LP Queen.
So for me I can't make up my mind if I prefer CDs to LPs, guess it depends upon my mood too. AS long as an LP is clean and not scratched or damaged they can come pretty close to CDs in terms of sound quality. I took my 1970 LP of Deep Purple In Rock for professional cleaning and it sounded almost immaculate. Alan that recording of Elgar's Symphony no.2 sounded so clean I couldn't beleive this was a 1927 recording.  I've CDs  of Robert Johnson, recordings  from 1936/7 it's possible to hear plenty of background noise.

Re Wagner I guess what I've got is a compilation it starts with Ride Of The Valkeries , Lohengrin, Overture Tannhauser , Siegfreid Idyll, Dawn and Siegfreid's Rhine Journey and ther Deathmarch. This is followed by Die Meister Singers von Nurnburg ( Master Singers of Nuremburg.
So this sounds like it's the Ring Cycle, as the Rhine Journey and Death March are from Gotterdammerung (Twilight of The Gods), Here's me trying to think about rings in Norse Mythology. I did  read that in Wagner's Ringcycle all the Gods perish at Ragnarok, but in the folk tales "The Eddas" the reality is somewhat different.

Apologies again for taking this topic off to another tangent, going via many different tangents    ;).

I guess with classical music I might seem a bit ignorant as I often know the piece, but not what it's called or who it's by  :O


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Alan D Offline




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Posted: Mar. 08 2007, 05:22

Quote (moonchildhippy @ Mar. 07 2007, 23:46)
Re Wagner I guess what I've got is a compilation it starts with Ride Of The Valkeries , Lohengrin, Overture Tannhauser , Siegfreid Idyll, Dawn and Siegfreid's Rhine Journey and ther Deathmarch. This is followed by Die Meister Singers von Nurnburg ( Master Singers of Nuremburg.

That sounds like an 'orchestral highlights' collection. If you haven't heard Wagner with the singing, you'll be in for a bit of a shock!

I'll send you a pm about it.
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Alan D Offline




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Posted: April 06 2008, 17:15

This thread went round the houses quite a bit, but it started out as a tip-off for a bargain box of Tchaikovsky symphonies - a complete cycle of the symphonies by Andrew Litton and the Bournmouth Symphony Orchestra. Here it is on Amazon - still a snip if bought through some of the Marketplace sellers:

Bargain box set of Tchaikovsky symphonies

Ugo raised a question about the quality of 'bargain boxes' like these, so I was interested recently to see that the Gramophone Classical Music Guide rated it very highly. They give it a two-disc' rating ('outstanding performance and fine sound' ), commenting that the set would still be highly recommendable even at twice the price. Anyway, I thought it worth adding this extra snippet of info in case anyone out there is wanting a cheap Tchaikovsky set, and is put off by suspicions about the performances in this one.
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Ugo Offline




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Posted: April 07 2008, 18:17

@ Alan: you still haven't convinced me. :D And however I don't like all of Tchaikovsky's symphonies... I only like the sixth, and I only like it as part of it was used in one of my favourite movies of the last decade, Minority Report. So I don't think I will be spending £15 on something I won't be actually listening... :D

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Olivier Offline




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Posted: April 07 2008, 18:45

I love his piano concerto no.1 http://youtube.com/watch?v=JbsvPMbC55A especially when the piano is solo.
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Alan D Offline




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Posted: April 08 2008, 04:27

Quote (Ugo @ April 07 2008, 22:17)
you still haven't convinced me.

I wasn't trying to convince you, Ugo - just adding more information.

Quote
And however I don't like all of Tchaikovsky's symphonies... I only like the sixth

I'm not a great Tchaikovsky fan myself - I bought the set because it enabled me to explore (and in some cases remind myself about) the whole range of his symphonies, very cheaply (for a lot less than £15 at that time, actually). I'd forgotten the great tune in the slow movement of the 5th, and the fanfare opening of the 4th ('fate knocking at the door' ) is tremendous.

@Olivier
Quote
I love his piano concerto no.1 especially when the piano is solo.

I'm not over-fond of piano music in general, but that surely is one of the most memorable tunes ever composed!
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Ugo Offline




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Posted: April 09 2008, 16:32

Quote (Alan D @ April 08 2008, 10:27)
Quote (Ugo @ April 07 2008, 22:17)
you still haven't convinced me.

I wasn't trying to convince you, Ugo - just adding more information.

I know you weren't, Alan. Indeed my comment was meant as sarcastic. :D

About the first piano concerto, I love it... and yes, I agree with you about the tune being memorable... it's even been made into a pop song down here... more than once. :)


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Incantations Offline




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Posted: Aug. 02 2010, 02:24

Sorry to bring up a relatively old topic but I felt the need to add this:

On itunes right now, they have a deal that has 24 hours of complete classical albums all for 10 US dollars. I don't know how US currency translates to other countries, but I can tell you all, that that is really, really cheap. so-- 22 albums for 10 bucks, thats around 50 cents an album. jeez...


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nightspore Offline




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Posted: Aug. 03 2010, 07:21

I hadn't seen this thread, Incantations, so you're forgiven...

I'm not a huge Tchaikovsky fan: with one exception, his second piano concerto. Hardly anyone knows it, but it's full of exuberance and life: far better, in my opinion, than any of the symphonies or the first piano concerto. I also like "Capriccio Italien", although it has the kind of structure about which Sir M complains with regard to Taurus 2: jumping from one style of music to another.

Ugo, do you know either of these works?
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nightspore Offline




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Posted: Aug. 03 2010, 08:25

Incidentally, Tchaikovsky's 4th is known to every Pink Floyd fan: the orchestral excerpt on "Wish You Were Here", just after the words about "Derek, this star nonsense", comes from this symphony.
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Ugo Offline




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Posted: Aug. 03 2010, 18:07

@ nightspore: oh, then I guess Fernie doesn't like Amarok? :D Joking aside, yes, I know Capriccio italien, and, being Italian, I can appreciate a little bit more more than you foreigners (no offence intended!! :D) the way Tchaikovski used two (three? four?) folk tunes from my homeland, which I've known at least since I was 2 - no kidding. I've never heard the second piano concerto, though. Of course I know the bombastic first one, which has always sounded a bit too technically complex to me. But of course I love those huge, huge, huge orchestral melodies. :)

I know about that bit in WYWH because I used to play that song with a band, a very long time ago. We played an extremely faithful rendition of it, including the radio interference, and I had to find where did that bit come from, in order to learn and play it on my keyboard.


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