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olracUK Group: Members Posts: 1683 Joined: June 2003 Posted: Aug. 26 2009, 18:37 Problem is - how to define "Rock" as opposed to, say, Metal, Prog or anything else? -------------- The answer is 42 - but what is the question? Back to top

larstangmark Group: Members Posts: 1760 Joined: Mar. 2005 Posted: Aug. 27 2009, 03:34 Quote (olracUK @ Aug. 26 2009, 18:37) Problem is - how to define "Rock" as opposed to, say, Metal, Prog or anything else? Exactly. The term "rock" has been used to describe just about any music recorded after 1970 that does not file under jazz or classical. However I feel that Carcass really "rocks" as opposed to most of Carl Perkins' back catalogue. But that's subjective of course... -------------- "There are twelve people in the world, the rest are paste" Mark E Smith Back to top

The Caveman Group: Members Posts: 2178 Joined: Jan. 2008 Posted: Aug. 27 2009, 09:09 Mr Oldfield said of Shadow On The Wall (which had been described as HM)"We used to simply call it Rock".  There's no way to define it really easily.Loud guitars bass and drums tend to be prominant and,if we're talking 'Classic Rock' it usually has it's roots in blues,or the early rock stuff from the late 60's (ie Free,Cream,Hendrix et all) does at least.A puzzler for the musicologists years from now methinks. -------------- THE COMING OF THE GREAT WHITE HANDKERCHEIF IS NIGH. Back to top

Scatterplot Group: Members Posts: 1980 Joined: Dec. 2007 Posted: Aug. 27 2009, 12:57 When I answered the thread, my thinking of "rock" is 4/4 time, guitars/bass/drums/vocals, commercial enough for FM airplay. Perhaps Silver should have provided a more clear definition of "rock". But she did cleverly open the door for a thread with much discussion and debate(we like that). "Rock" as I once knew it is almost dead. Years ago, it was decided "heavy metal" was a seperate genre. MO, while "rock", I consider "art-rock" like YES, Genesis, PF, all of whom -did- have moments of real "rock" or "rock n roll". I am old, which means words like "indie" mean crap to me. WTF is that? Indian? The motorcycle? The country? Native Americans? See? The label "rock" made sense in say, 1974. We would think of the Stones. Today, there is so much diversity in cultures(all relocating due to wars), we don't know WTF we are listening to! So, I simply defer to Journey and Grand Funk Railroad. That was "Rock". So was the Who, barring arty rock opera. Led Zep, Bad Company(thats rock!. Doobie brothers(the band -before- Mike Mcdonald. That's rock. Early Beatles(cavern club).....thats rock n roll. Whatever, it's to me, a commercially radio-play attractable product in 4/4 time, using 5th intervals a lot. It makes your toes tap. It makes you want to roll a doobie or drink a beer. Thats rock. -------------- We raise our voices in the night Crying to heaven And will our voices be heard Or will they break Like the wind Back to top

Silver Negus Group: Members Posts: 357 Joined: Sep. 2007 Posted: Aug. 27 2009, 13:07 Quote (Scatterplot @ Aug. 27 2009, 12:57) When I answered the thread, my thinking of "rock" is 4/4 time, guitars/bass/drums/vocals, commercial enough for FM airplay. Perhaps Silver should have provided a more clear definition of "rock". But she did cleverly open the door for a thread with much discussion and debate(we like that). "Rock" as I once knew it is almost dead. Years ago, it was decided "heavy metal" was a seperate genre. MO, while "rock", I consider "art-rock" like YES, Genesis, PF, all of whom -did- have moments of real "rock" or "rock n roll". I am old, which means words like "indie" mean crap to me. WTF is that? Indian? The motorcycle? The country? Native Americans? See? The label "rock" made sense in say, 1974. We would think of the Stones. Today, there is so much diversity in cultures(all relocating due to wars), we don't know WTF we are listening to! So, I simply defer to Journey and Grand Funk Railroad. That was "Rock". So was the Who, barring arty rock opera. Led Zep, Bad Company(thats rock!. Doobie brothers(the band -before- Mike Mcdonald. That's rock. Early Beatles(cavern club).....thats rock n roll. Whatever, it's to me, a commercially radio-play attractable product in 4/4 time, using 5th intervals a lot. It makes your toes tap. It makes you want to roll a doobie or drink a beer. Thats rock. I'm a wazzock! I didnt specify. To be honest I've been having a bad few months and I'm tired. I did a zine on prog rock this year. Do we have to have a debate on what type of music fits in which criteria? You know if I have an opinion I'll get eaten alive if I get it wrong!     Back to top

Scatterplot Group: Members Posts: 1980 Joined: Dec. 2007 Posted: Aug. 27 2009, 13:50 Maybe, but your new avatar sure is nice! This thread evoked a lot of definitional talk. Good! It gets the brain cells a workin'...Plus we get to see that fine photo again. Not only have you succeded at fighting Alzheimer's disease, you have added to the essence of all that is art. Well done! Jimbo -------------- We raise our voices in the night Crying to heaven And will our voices be heard Or will they break Like the wind Back to top

wiga Group: Members Posts: 2113 Joined: Sep. 2008 Posted: Aug. 27 2009, 14:18 Ok - well for archetypal rock and roll it's got to be "I'm Going Home."  But you've got to listen to the full 15 minutes from Woodstock for the full effect. Good ROCK gets under your skin - that's how you know. 10 Years After - I'm Going Home Going Home ----Going Home -----Going Home----     With her red dress on ----- -------------- Barn's burnt down - now I can see the moon. Back to top

Silver Negus Group: Members Posts: 357 Joined: Sep. 2007 Posted: Aug. 27 2009, 15:09 Quote (Scatterplot @ Aug. 27 2009, 13:50) Maybe, but your new avatar sure is nice! This thread evoked a lot of definitional talk. Good! It gets the brain cells a workin'...Plus we get to see that fine photo again. Not only have you succeded at fighting Alzheimer's disease, you have added to the essence of all that is art. Well done! Jimbo    Bless your heart! Back to top

Silver Negus Group: Members Posts: 357 Joined: Sep. 2007 Posted: Aug. 27 2009, 15:19 Different types of rock- 1- music- Rock on! 2- a big piece of stone which sometimes you can sit on. Since  I'm a small size thats possible. 3-lovely sweet stuff you can buy on holiday- yummm! 4- rock crystals- science stuff. 5- rock salt. 6- 'Freggle Rock'- muppet TV show. Help cant think of any others? My IQ certainly not hitting the 'superior level' here! Back to top

larstangmark Group: Members Posts: 1760 Joined: Mar. 2005 Posted: Aug. 27 2009, 16:14 Mike's early albums are made up of little snippets of folk rock, art rock and even some hard rock. That they are pieced together in what loosely resembles a "classical" structure doesn't make the whole thing less "rock". Even if there are 11/8 sections or whatever there is stil la sense of beat that is unmistakeably "rock". If the long monotone sections of Hergest Ridge are built around a firm beat (obviously a metronome was used for the recordings) even though it's not in the mix. To take an example of something from the same time that was not necersarily "rock" I can mention Tangerine Dream ca Atem/Phaedra. That's more jazz/improv. Rock puts emphasis on composition and script. -------------- "There are twelve people in the world, the rest are paste" Mark E Smith Back to top

olracUK Group: Members Posts: 1683 Joined: June 2003 Posted: Aug. 27 2009, 17:36 Quote (Silver Negus @ Aug. 27 2009, 20:19) Different types of rock- 1- music- Rock on! 2- a big piece of stone which sometimes you can sit on. Since  I'm a small size thats possible. 3-lovely sweet stuff you can buy on holiday- yummm! 4- rock crystals- science stuff. 5- rock salt. 6- 'Freggle Rock'- muppet TV show. Help cant think of any others? My IQ certainly not hitting the 'superior level' here! ROCK cake? -------------- The answer is 42 - but what is the question? Back to top

Silver Negus Group: Members Posts: 357 Joined: Sep. 2007 Posted: Aug. 27 2009, 18:25 Quote (olracUK @ Aug. 27 2009, 17:36) Quote (Silver Negus @ Aug. 27 2009, 20:19) Different types of rock- 1- music- Rock on! 2- a big piece of stone which sometimes you can sit on. Since  I'm a small size thats possible. 3-lovely sweet stuff you can buy on holiday- yummm! 4- rock crystals- science stuff. 5- rock salt. 6- 'Freggle Rock'- muppet TV show. Help cant think of any others? My IQ certainly not hitting the 'superior level' here! ROCK cake? of course! and do you know what why didnt I think of that I make them all the time! Back to top

olracUK Group: Members Posts: 1683 Joined: June 2003 Posted: Aug. 27 2009, 20:19 Your brain is obviously too highly tuned to notice such mundane things Silver. But getting back on track - assuming that bands like Guns 'n' Roses are "Rock" (as currently defined by the MTV generation) - big drums, big guitar and big hair - then i would say Earth Moving and Heavens Open are Mike's "rockiest" albums. My personal vote for best rock album would be Bon Jovi Slippery When Wet. But potentially best ever Rock song? Maybe Springsteen Born in The USA. Classic hook, chorus, etc. Over exposed now - but it has all the elements -------------- The answer is 42 - but what is the question? Back to top

Tati The Sentinel Group: Members Posts: 3360 Joined: Feb. 2002 Posted: Aug. 27 2009, 20:52 Fleetwood Mac with Go Your Own Way,what a rockier tune to rock on \o/ -------------- "But it's always the outsider, the black sheep, that becomes the blockbuster." - Mike Oldfield, 2014 "I remember feeling that I'd been judged unfairly and that I was going to prove them wrong." - Peter Davison, 2011 Back to top

raven4x4x Group: Members Posts: 1535 Joined: Jan. 2002 Posted: Aug. 28 2009, 03:58 Quote (olracUK @ Aug. 28 2009, 09:19) potentially best ever Rock song? Maybe Springsteen Born in The USA. Classic hook, chorus, etc. Over exposed now - but it has all the elements I would suggest Springsteen's Born to Run, certainly my favourite 'classic rock' song. Gets me moving every time!   -------------- Thank-you for helping us help you help us all. Back to top

Silver Negus Group: Members Posts: 357 Joined: Sep. 2007 Posted: Aug. 28 2009, 06:53 Quote (olracUK @ Aug. 27 2009, 20:19) Your brain is obviously too highly tuned to notice such mundane things Silver. But getting back on track - assuming that bands like Guns 'n' Roses are "Rock" (as currently defined by the MTV generation) - big drums, big guitar and big hair - then i would say Earth Moving and Heavens Open are Mike's "rockiest" albums. My personal vote for best rock album would be Bon Jovi Slippery When Wet. But potentially best ever Rock song? Maybe Springsteen Born in The USA. Classic hook, chorus, etc. Over exposed now - but it has all the elements I'd agree with all of that. Back to top

Silver Negus Group: Members Posts: 357 Joined: Sep. 2007 Posted: Aug. 28 2009, 19:50 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wDKHG alone again or. Back to top

3Wheeler Group: Members Posts: 828 Joined: Aug. 2007 Posted: Sep. 28 2009, 06:03 All the Way From Memphis - Mott The Hoople  ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wvarPF5zlUA Theyre Still gigging   Ian Is 70 now and still giving it some I Hear.. All the Young Dudes is a Candidate  but Think its a bit to Beatlesque to be a Included... -------------- We're Flying Aeroflot, We've Got Reservations. Back to top

Scatterplot Group: Members Posts: 1980 Joined: Dec. 2007 Posted: Sep. 28 2009, 11:24 "Rock" to me, the toe tapping kind.....revolves around subjects like fast cars. Foreigner "Rev On The Red Line"....gets my motor runnin'(Steppenwolf tie-in) or Led Zep's "dancing Days". A little darker and D-modal, but a toe tapper fer sure. -------------- We raise our voices in the night Crying to heaven And will our voices be heard Or will they break Like the wind Back to top

ex member 419 Group: Members Posts: 1177 Joined: April 2008 Posted: Dec. 12 2009, 18:37 Thats easy! Sweet Child of Mine by Guns and Roses. Just love that lick/riff at the beginning. That is guitar playing! Mm might go play my guitar right now, minus the amp, cant have neighbours whining lol! Deb Back to top

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