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Cinos Group: Members Posts: 68 Joined: Aug. 2005 Posted: Oct. 01 2005, 16:24 Is it just me or is this track utterly amazing? The signature melody has huge classic potential, almost Tubular Bells level. Also, it's very emotional... closest I've ever been to crying while listening to music... right after Far Above The Clouds.   Back to top

Sir Mustapha Group: Musicians Posts: 2802 Joined: April 2003 Posted: Oct. 02 2005, 09:01 The first minute and a half of the song is exactly the type of music that gets played in the background of radio adverts of hotels and hardware stores. And the other five minutes don't really build much on top of that. In short, I disagree: it's one of the lamest tracks in Light. -------------- Check out http://ferniecanto.com.br for all my music, including my latest albums: Don't Stay in the City, Making Amends and Builders of Worlds. Also check my Bandcamp page: http://ferniecanto.bandcamp.com Back to top

Alan D Group: Members Posts: 3670 Joined: Aug. 2004 Posted: Oct. 02 2005, 10:20 The main theme, here, is taken from a passage in Maestro where keys are used to unlock a set of cages and free the birds that they contain. (It'll be interesting to see what you think of that, Cinos.) The whole episode is lovely, and intensely memorable, and the music fits beautifully. I must admit I very much prefer that short and simple looped arrangement of the tune to this one, and particularly I find the religious tone of the 'Our Father' vocals here quite off-putting (though that's a particular baggage problem of my own). But I just tried the U-myx software on this track. The only thing I did was cancel all the vocals, but I must say it has transformed it as a listening experience - and proves conclusively that the synthetic voices are posing a significant barrier, for me. Back to top

Inkanta Group: Admins Posts: 1453 Joined: Feb. 2000 Posted: Dec. 02 2005, 20:13 This is still pretty-much my favorite piece on Light. I find it very meditative and a lovely tribute to the departed Pope. I happened to be listening to it at work today, while catching up on emails. One of those contained news of the passing of Vine Deloria, Jr., which happened a couple of weeks ago (thought I felt a disturbance in the space-time fabric). He was a major figure in the Native rights movements (e.g., the American Indian Movement; Native American Graves Protection and Repatriation Act) and a brilliant educator (theology & law). Some called him the Native American Pope, though Native American spirituality is too diverse to have a pope--probably more to do with his humans rights work involving issues of Native spirituality. You can read about his passing in any of the major online news sources, but here is a Native source and here is another one. Do not completely rest in peace, Vine Deloria. Rather, in peace and solidarity, dance, laugh, and continue to inspire the coming generations. -------------- "No such thing as destiny; only choices exist." From:  Moongarden's "Solaris." Back to top

raven4x4x Group: Members Posts: 1535 Joined: Jan. 2002 Posted: Dec. 02 2005, 20:44 I've never really liked it. It's OK, but it never seems to really do anything after it starts. Far too repetitive for my liking. -------------- Thank-you for helping us help you help us all. Back to top

Inkanta Group: Admins Posts: 1453 Joined: Feb. 2000 Posted: Dec. 02 2005, 21:13 Indeed, it is very repetitive, but as a meditative piece, it seems to work quite well. -------------- "No such thing as destiny; only choices exist." From:  Moongarden's "Solaris." Back to top

Alan D Group: Members Posts: 3670 Joined: Aug. 2004 Posted: Dec. 03 2005, 05:31 As time has gone on, my response to it has changed quite a bit. I've listened a good deal now to two versions - the original, and one with the synthetic vocals removed, and sadly, the outcome is that neither of them work for me. The only part I can enjoy is the very beginning (where I have some very beautiful associations with the 'freeing the birds' episode in Maestro); the rest rapidly becomes irritating now, whether the vocals are there or not. This kind of repetitive music walks a narrow personal line, I think. What to one person is a helpful aid to meditation can so easily be a block to someone else, if the repeated tune becomes unpleasant, rather than restful. I don't know whether the explanation for the difference is psychological or physiological? Or maybe both? Back to top

Tubularman Group: Awaiting Authorisation Posts: 2304 Joined: June 2004 Posted: Dec. 03 2005, 08:24 "Our Father".. The first song i got to know and hear from Light and Shade. This song do touch me. But i prefer my own mix of it. Sorry.... The reason is that i have take away those "oooouuurrr faaaaaaather". (not all of the vocals but some) But one thing is in my mind.. Do some of you think about what this song is about??? Mike said: "I worked on it around the time the pope died, and what a fascinating and wonderful life he had; when he died, it didn't feel like he was gone, and it all just seeped into my consciousness, and ended up with this title. For me, it encapsulates the whole man's lifetime, and his death" I dont think about the pope. I think more deeper, like God maybe. The choir is to deep to mean pope. No, its just not a song to him for me... But i loves "Our father" -------------- Mike Oldfield M i x e s https://soundcloud.com/tubularman Back to top

Tati The Sentinel Group: Members Posts: 3360 Joined: Feb. 2002 Posted: Dec. 03 2005, 08:51 Another source of inspiration was Mike himself being a father for the 6th time last year...more info on the Hiawatha II interview with him! -------------- "But it's always the outsider, the black sheep, that becomes the blockbuster." - Mike Oldfield, 2014 "I remember feeling that I'd been judged unfairly and that I was going to prove them wrong." - Peter Davison, 2011 Back to top

Navaira Group: Members Posts: 481 Joined: Jan. 2005 Posted: Dec. 03 2005, 09:17 This track doesn't touch me in any way, I think it's rather boring, actually. It's not on my one CD version of the album. -------------- http://www.raygrant.com :: My album 'Exorcism' is out on iTunes now Back to top

Tubularman Group: Awaiting Authorisation Posts: 2304 Joined: June 2004 Posted: Dec. 03 2005, 09:54 Quote (Tati The Sentinel @ Dec. 03 2005, 14:51) Another source of inspiration was Mike himself being a father for the 6th time last year...more info on the Hiawatha II interview with him! Mike is for me; "Our music father"   -------------- Mike Oldfield M i x e s https://soundcloud.com/tubularman Back to top

Inkanta Group: Admins Posts: 1453 Joined: Feb. 2000 Posted: Dec. 03 2005, 18:03 Quote (Tubularman @ Dec. 03 2005, 07:24) I dont think about the pope. I think more deeper, like God maybe. The choir is to deep to mean pope. No, its just not a song to him for me... I'm a fairly calm and laid-back person, but when it comes on, I feel this deep sense of calmness and relaxation that leaves me very reflective. I often think of the Pope and his life, and others of peace and how far we still have to go. But that there is hope. It was, therefore, just a bit weird to be listening to this while reading about the death of Vine Deloria, Jr. (explained above). He was a hero of mine, and partially responsible for my path in life. Reading some of the other comments, I am going to try mixing out the voices and see if I like the results even better. Psychological or physiological? I dunno, but when I next have access to PsycInfo I can research it and see what I find in the literature. -------------- "No such thing as destiny; only choices exist." From:  Moongarden's "Solaris." Back to top

Alan D Group: Members Posts: 3670 Joined: Aug. 2004 Posted: Dec. 03 2005, 19:10 Quote (Inkanta @ Dec. 03 2005, 23:03) Psychological or physiological? I dunno, but when I next have access to PsycInfo I can research it and see what I find in the literature. Honesty compells me to admit that I find almost everything by Bach irritating in a very similar way. Something about that kind of non-stop plinkety-plonk sound makes me feel progressively more uncomfortable, as it does here. So my response says nothing at all about the quality of the music; only about something to do with my ears and/or brain! Back to top

Inkanta Group: Admins Posts: 1453 Joined: Feb. 2000 Posted: Dec. 03 2005, 21:44 Hmmm....and I really, really, really like Bach. I haven't posted in the classical music topic because I cannot narrow my favorites to under 20 composers.  When I was playing in Psychological Articles the other evening (and PsycInfo), I retrieved an overwhelming amount of citations and articles on music and the brain; in fact, I didn't have time to narrow the results (had forgotten it was the last day of the trials).  Those that looked extremely interesting I emailed to myself--and promptly lost them.  I managed to find a few interesting things in Philosopher's Index, and the added material (like the examples and footnotes) was deleted. Irritating. So...when I visit the local university in a couple of weeks, which has those databases (have to be onsite to get the password), I am going to take the time and buggy through them. Happiness: Searching for cool stuff in a database. -------------- "No such thing as destiny; only choices exist." From:  Moongarden's "Solaris." Back to top

Alan D Group: Members Posts: 3670 Joined: Aug. 2004 Posted: Dec. 04 2005, 06:44 Quote (Inkanta @ Dec. 04 2005, 02:44) Happiness: Searching for cool stuff in a database. Yes. Or even better, in old books.... What I've never understood (perhaps because I've not seriously tried! ) is what the actual physical source of irritation is in music we dislike: whether it's the character of the sound itself, or the pattern of notes, or both. I suspect it takes both for it to get really jarring. But here's another curious thing: sometimes it's possible to stand 'outside' a piece of music and hear it as others might hear it. So I can readily understand, for instance, why someone might find a Puccini aria an intolerable mess of wailing and screeching, even though for me it's a ticket to Heaven. Look at this variety of response, here, too. Some people are obviously being really moved by those synthetic 'Our Father's in this Mike piece; whereas I just can't cope with the apparent absurdity of the sound of them, repeated over and over: 'Aaaahhh Fotheerrrrrrr'. But what strikes me as absurdity is presumably caused by the personal associations I make; and for others, these sounds have wholly different associations that make them respond positively ... oh, this is too enormous a topic, isn't it? It will be so nice when you've done all that hard work and told us in a few sentences how it all works, Inkanta ..... Sometimes it seems amazing that human beings can ever actually agree about anything at all.   Back to top

Holger Group: Members Posts: 1506 Joined: Feb. 2003 Posted: Dec. 04 2005, 08:52 Quote (Alan D @ Dec. 04 2005, 12:44) Look at this variety of response, here, too. Some people are obviously being really moved by those synthetic 'Our Father's in this Mike piece; whereas I just can't cope with the apparent absurdity of the sound of them, repeated over and over: 'Aaaahhh Fotheerrrrrrr'. But what strikes me as absurdity is presumably caused by the personal associations I make; and for others, these sounds have wholly different associations that make them respond positively ... I think those elements of absurdity are a big part of what I like about Mike's music. Listen to some of the lead guitar playing on some of his older recordings, let's say up to QE2 (I think his playing got progressively tighter as time went on) - it's so sloppy sometimes it's almost unbelievable, but he can not only pull it off and make it convincing, I'd actually go as far as saying that's what's so good about it. Or, speaking of QE2, listen to Celt... the whole piece is simply ridiculous, with those drums that are completely outside of anything most people would consider a good sense of timing, and that incredibly naive harmony and melody on top of it. Still, it's a piece I absolutely adore, not in spite of, but because of those things I mentioned. There would be tons of other examples, and I could possibly post some more as I think of them if it's unclear to anyone what I'm talking about, but I think the point comes across. I see much of the synthetic voices on L+S in exactly that tradition. Another example there would be how the word "net" in Surfing is pronounced so strangely, or how the voices in Tears of an Angel seem to say "fallen like pain" when you know that in fact that's not what they're supposed to be singing at all. Back to top

Alan D Group: Members Posts: 3670 Joined: Aug. 2004 Posted: Dec. 04 2005, 10:48 Quote (Holger @ Dec. 04 2005, 13:52) I think those elements of absurdity are a big part of what I like about Mike's music. Ah, now here we are, you see - a perfect illustration of what I was saying. On the whole, I enjoy Mike's music in spite of those absurdities that you enjoy. I'm not sure, though, that sloppy playing falls into that category. But the bits of Mike that make me squirm most uncomfortably are things like the caveman grunts in Tubular Bells, the crazy noises and ersatz swearwords in Amarok, and of course the "Ahhhhh fotheerrrr"s in the L&S track. How remarkable this is though - the very things you enjoy most are the things I most dislike, and yet we're still drawn like a magnet to the same artist. Back to top

Holger Group: Members Posts: 1506 Joined: Feb. 2003 Posted: Dec. 04 2005, 11:13 Quote (Alan D @ Dec. 04 2005, 16:48) How remarkable this is though - the very things you enjoy most are the things I most dislike, and yet we're still drawn like a magnet to the same artist. Ah well, I think that might be saying a bit much. I'm sure there's elements of Mike's music which we can agree are great, or agree aren't great. I know how uneasy you feel about Amarok, for one thing, and even though that was the album that initially got me into Mike (simply because it was so different from anything I'd heard before), I'd actually agree that it is a bit too absurd at certain times. I think it's more that I like those elements of absurdity to spice up what is great music to begin with, and give it that extra special bit of something that sets it apart from other great music. And it's also not as if the absurdity is the only thing in Mike's music that does that, I think he has a lot more to offer than that. Back to top

Korkesova Group: Members Posts: 73 Joined: Nov. 2005 Posted: Dec. 04 2005, 13:12 I often listen Amarok, is very interest, is as talk whit Mike. I had this feeling from old albums. And L+S bring  peace, aquanimity well-being. Missing warmth, aspiration, emergency. After all like i Light, is relaxacion, Shade very exact working, tone, sounds beautiful souding - good working. MO is about in personal live comfortable and have not use ventilate his anguish trough music. I tip next album in style QE 2. Vivat MO ! Sorry my English, is unknowing ! -------------- it's never too late for me Back to top

Alan D Group: Members Posts: 3670 Joined: Aug. 2004 Posted: Dec. 04 2005, 13:22 Quote (Holger @ Dec. 04 2005, 16:13) I think it's more that I like those elements of absurdity to spice up what is great music to begin with, and give it that extra special bit of something that sets it apart from other great music. And it's also not as if the absurdity is the only thing in Mike's music that does that, I think he has a lot more to offer than that. So are we saying, then, that there's a central 'great' core In Mike's music? And it's that which is attracting us primarily? That makes more sense to me, I must say. It may be that our differing tastes are more about the window dressing than the goods actually on offer. So - I like my coffee rich, strong, and black with sugar. You (perhaps) like it weak, delicate, and white with no sweetening. And we could go around and around discussing the merits of strength, sugar, milk, and so on - while all the time the really important factor - the one that causes us to discuss it at all - is that coffee is wonderful. We need a coffee thread..... Back to top

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