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Topic: Ommadawn re-release - a few thoughts...< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
ian Offline




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Posted: June 28 2009, 14:06

The African drums need to go on much longer on the fade out. They are too quiet. The rest of the album doesn't need tweaking at all. It's got an atmosphere and putting new reverbs on it would kill it.
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Tati The Sentinel Offline




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Posted: June 28 2009, 18:19

What about the Ommadawn version that Mike did on NNOTP with orchestra?

I'd love to watch it again!


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wiga Offline




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Posted: June 29 2009, 05:17

Quote (ian @ June 28 2009, 14:06)
The African drums need to go on much longer on the fade out. They are too quiet. The rest of the album doesn't need tweaking at all. It's got an atmosphere and putting new reverbs on it would kill it.

I'd forgotten about that drum beat at the end, but yes, it probably should go on for longer in the fade out.  I like it's rhythm and could probably listen to it for an hour or so, but more importantly, it precedes that abrupt release of tension, and conveys the sudden return to a normal calm state where I would like to linger much longer. I'd appreciate more time in that peaceful state - before "Horseback."

I also don't see anything else that needs "tweaking" - perfect!


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ian Offline




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Posted: June 29 2009, 19:29

When the acoustic guitar comes in at the beginning of side one, there are male voices with the female. Does anyone know who the male are ? I adore that bit. Absolute nirvana.
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larstangmark Offline




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Posted: June 30 2009, 01:16

Quote (ian @ June 29 2009, 19:29)
When the acoustic guitar comes in at the beginning of side one, there are male voices with the female. Does anyone know who the male are ? I adore that bit. Absolute nirvana.

That's Bridget StJohn. Definately not a man, but a mighty low female voice. Check out her solo albums for a pleasant surprise.

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nightspore Offline




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Posted: June 30 2009, 02:28

Quote (ian @ June 29 2009, 19:29)
. Does anyone know who the male are ? I adore that bit. Absolute nirvana.

No, I don't think it was Cobain.
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ian Offline




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Posted: June 30 2009, 06:47

There is definatley a male voice in there. Trust me ;-)
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The Caveman Offline




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Posted: June 30 2009, 07:58

I know Mike does sing towards the end of side two the only two voices on side one are Clodagh Simmonds and Bridget St John.Bridget St John does have a very very deep voice and is mixed with Clodagh in the bit you describe.It sounds male i agree but having listened to it more times than can be healthy it's definately Bridget.

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familyjules Offline




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Posted: May 27 2010, 05:35

Hello, long time no see.  Have I missed anything?  ;)

I'm really looking forward to the Ommadawn and Hergest Ridge deluxe editions.  I played the Tubular Bells 2009 remix yesterday in anticipation.  In the meantime I've been back here reading some threads I missed out on.  All your names and personalities came flooding back.

Lots of love to all,

Jules


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Incantations Offline




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Posted: June 06 2010, 14:34

aww... Hi Jules!

I think I'm a bit more excited for HR then Ommadawn, as it has the original version (Good call MO!;)


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ian Offline




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Posted: June 07 2010, 09:47

Quote (Scatterplot @ June 15 2009, 13:43)
I don't get this Ommadawn remaster stuff. It was high tech enough, and already remastered....or cleaned up for CD years ago. I'm thinking this trend of "OK Tubularians, I'm gonna remix all my old albums" needs to end. It's time for fresh material. HR was cleaned up enough by some guy named Bartosik(sp) and me. Ommadawn is fine, so is Incantations. Focus on new material. Please. If MO is still tinkering with software and instruments, it's time to move on......Gimme something new. Not trying to be ugly......just move on..........The rarities are getting old. Get some inspiration from that oceanic experience and compose. "QE2 2" Or have a woman sing DH Lawrence "Whales weep not" to marimbas, synths and guitars. Here's the lyrics:

They say the sea is cold, but the sea contains
the hottest blood of all, and the wildest, the most urgent.

All the whales in the wider deeps, hot are they, as they urge
on and on, and dive beneath the icebergs.
The right whales, the sperm-whales, the hammer-heads, the killers
there they blow, there they blow, hot wild white breath out of the sea!

And they rock, and they rock, through the sensual ageless ages
on the depths of the seven seas,
and through the salt they reel with drunk delight
and in the tropics tremble they with love
and roll with massive, strong desire, like gods.
Then the great bull lies up against his bride
in the blue deep of the sea

as mountain pressing on mountain, in the zest of life:
and out of the inward roaring of the inner red ocean of whale blood
the long tip reaches strong, intense, like the maelstrom-tip, and comes to rest
in the clasp and the soft, wild clutch of a she-whale's fathomless body.

And over the bridge of the whale's strong phallus, linking the wonder of whales
the burning archangels under the sea keep passing, back and forth,
keep passing archangels of bliss
from him to her, from her to him, great Cherubim
that wait on whales in mid-ocean, suspended in the waves of the sea
great heaven of whales in the waters, old hierarchies.
And enormous mother whales lie dreaming suckling their whale-tender young
and dreaming with strange whale eyes wide open in the waters of the beginning and the end.

And bull-whales gather their women and whale-calves in a ring
when danger threatens, on the surface of the ceaseless flood
and range themselves like great fierce Seraphim facing the threat
encircling their huddled monsters of love.
and all this happiness in the sea, in the salt
where God is also love, but without words:
and Aphrodite is the wife of whales
most happy, happy she!

and Venus among the fishes skips and is a she-dolphin
she is the gay, delighted porpoise sporting with love and the sea
she is the female tunny-fish, round and happy among the males
and dense with happy blood, dark rainbow bliss in the sea.

    The part "And they Rock and they Rock"......at that point speed tempo and add overdubbed guitars. Food for thought old friend.....I'm hearing the finished product in my head. And it is good.
Jimbo

Whats that got to do with Ommadawn ?????

Sounds like new age speel to me ;-)
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Cudsie Offline




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Posted: June 08 2010, 01:56

Well we all know you can't improve on perfection...and Mike proves that here...but he was so close!

Again like with Hergest Ridge there are some bizarre over emphases on parts which drown out the subtleties of other parts which upsets the overall balance of the piece. I wonder if he actually plays back these remixes on standard hi-fi equipment? Is he hearing what we hear?

A shame he didn't revert back to the leaping guitar solo at the beginning of Part One so beloved of many on here. There is a lot to like tho - more so than the HR remix in my opinion but the worst thing, and which generally makes me wonder how often I will play this mix again, is the muted climax to Part One. It starts off well with great attack from Jabula but then the mix seems to get muddier and when you're expecting the great theme to be restated to make your heart truly soar its all in the background and you feel like you've been cheated.
A great shame.

Part Two is much better tho - especially the ending which really comes alive.

The true revelation in my opinion tho is the remastered original '75 mix!! I never could stomach the 2000 remaster - it seemed too sterile and clinical - it had been robbed of the atmosphere and I just couldn't listen to it all the way through. It was as if there was a sheen over it which stopped the vibrancy coming through that I remembered from the vinyl.

Fortunately all that has been rectified with this release and the Original mix has been restored at last and I can finally listen to it as I remembered all those years ago for the first time.

As for the "Lost" version its really quite bizarre! It feels like you're going into a parallel universe when you hear things that you know so well suddenly going off at a different way to what you expect.

Some of it is astounding - a lot of it just doesn't work! The weird timing in the first 6 minutes is quite jarring. Its clearly a darker version - you can hear the mental anguish in him which he suffered at the time especially with the loss of his mother. In retrospect its like the bastard still born offspring he had to get out of his system before releasing the beautiful version we all know and love now.

The extremely incongruous verbal assault during the huge climax is quite quite hideous and made me feel quite nauseous! The huge Timpani finale by Pierre tho immediately after is astonishing and it would have been amazing if he had transferred that into the released version.

What a shame they couldn't put the French Single cut on this "expanded edition". (yet they managed to put "Spanish Tune" on Hergest Ridge!?) That would have sounded great.

Oh and with Mike's vox now fully up front "On Horseback" I think its safe to say there is no longer any confusion as to what he says on a certain line. Really what were some of you thinking?!

I will be fascinated to see what they do with Incantations now! Its very tempting to think that as they have put demos on TB, HR and O they will put the fab demo's of Incantations on as well! (oh and hopefully the single edit of Part 4 would be nice as well) fingers crossed.
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familyjules Offline




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Posted: June 08 2010, 04:06

Quote (Cudsie @ June 08 2010, 01:56)
Again like with Hergest Ridge there are some bizarre over emphases on parts which drown out the subtleties of other parts which upsets the overall balance of the piece.

the worst thing, and which generally makes me wonder how often I will play this mix again, is the muted climax to Part One. It starts off well with great attack from Jabula but then the mix seems to get muddier and when you're expecting the great theme to be restated to make your heart truly soar its all in the background and you feel like you've been cheated.
A great shame.

As for the "Lost" version its really quite bizarre! It feels like you're going into a parallel universe when you hear things that you know so well suddenly going off at a different way to what you expect.

Some of it is astounding - a lot of it just doesn't work! The weird timing in the first 6 minutes is quite jarring. Its clearly a darker version - you can hear the mental anguish in him which he suffered at the time especially with the loss of his mother. In retrospect its like the bastard still born offspring he had to get out of his system before releasing the beautiful version we all know and love now.

The extremely incongruous verbal assault during the huge climax is quite quite hideous and made me feel quite nauseous!

Oh and with Mike's vox now fully up front "On Horseback" I think its safe to say there is no longer any confusion as to what he says on a certain line. Really what were some of you thinking?!

I will be fascinated to see what they do with Incantations now!

I agree with so much of this post (particularly the edited highlights above).  Yes, there are some strange emphases.  Yes, the guitar climax is muted (the trumpet vying for attention with the guitar doesn't help).

Very much agree about the 'lost version'.  The early parts do seem darker.  The joking section is clearly a mistake and would have put me off the record for life if it had stayed in.  It undermines the music (as opposed to Viv on TB who worked beautifully).

I was wondering if Mike had emphasised his singing on the 'chaos' line of On Horseback on purpose.  I could almost hear the vocal channel being boosted for a couple of words and then being dipped back down again.

The kids singing is louder at the end of On Horseback.  Too loud imo, they drown Mike out and you can hear how out of time they were.  The charm is sacrificed for brutal reality!  There's also a spoken ad lib from Mike not previously heard.

I'm thinking that for Incantations we won't get much in the way of extras, if at all.  There'd be no room with a 3 disc box for anything except the album in new mix, original mix, and 5.1.  I just can't see them making a 4 disc box for it.  It'd be good if I was wrong though.

Jules


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Navaira Offline




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Posted: June 11 2010, 09:31

I think the 2010 mixes are AWESOME. The sound is so bloody clean. It's music that I know, but not the way I know it. It sounds as if it was recorded yesterday. (Well, in a way, it sort of was except not really...)

I prefer Hergest Ridge remix to Ommadawn remix, even though I find Ommadawn a better album; I find that the improvements in HR are truly mindblowing (the 100 Guitars section is just... *shakes head* ...pure trance), and improvements in Ommadawn are great, but nothing shocks me as much as the HR improvements.

I'm glad the new remasters of original mixes are on the deluxe edition as well -- time to get rid of those ugly HDCD ones!

Can't wait for Incantations.


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familyjules Offline




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Posted: June 11 2010, 10:39

Quote (Navaira @ June 11 2010, 09:31)
I'm glad the new remasters of original mixes are on the deluxe edition as well -- time to get rid of those ugly HDCD ones!

Don't be getting rid of the HDCD Hergest Ridge now - it's a different mix again, you know!

Jules


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Scatterplot Offline




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Posted: June 12 2010, 01:21

I can't resist: kids, there were NEVER 90 or 100 guitars in the side 2 section on HR you refer to. Over a year ago I gave a second-by-second examination of that storm section. There were no more than 7 or 8 guitar parts, including bass, on that passage. Why would there be? MO knew in 1974 that "90 guitar dubs" would be a waste of time. He was aware then and now that it would be a waste of time, effort and studio costs. And that the 16 or even 24 analog tape tracks available would be useless to "highlight" such an effort. It's an urban myth. Go put on your best studio grade headphones and listen. I've already pissed off so many here, why do I care telling the truth again? There are about 8 guitar parts there. That's the truth. Have a nice summer. Let's get that damn oil leak plugged in the gulf.
Jim


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larstangmark Offline




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Posted: June 12 2010, 03:17

Quote (Scatterplot @ June 12 2010, 01:21)
I can't resist: kids, there were NEVER 90 or 100 guitars in the side 2 section on HR you refer to. Over a year ago I gave a second-by-second examination of that storm section. There were no more than 7 or 8 guitar parts, including bass, on that passage. Why would there be? MO knew in 1974 that "90 guitar dubs" would be a waste of time. He was aware then and now that it would be a waste of time, effort and studio costs. And that the 16 or even 24 analog tape tracks available would be useless to "highlight" such an effort. It's an urban myth. Go put on your best studio grade headphones and listen. I've already pissed off so many here, why do I care telling the truth again? There are about 8 guitar parts there. That's the truth. Have a nice summer. Let's get that damn oil leak plugged in the gulf.
Jim

Mike was marketed as the overdubs guy, and that really stuck for some reason. As you say, 7 or 8 overbuds is what I hear at most.
Lars T


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3Wheeler Offline




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Posted: June 12 2010, 03:31

Who cares how many were used .. Its the Basic Effect that counts..  Its been Notched up a Level on the 2010 Recording and sounds just Awesome... I think that is the Important point .  :cool:

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Jimmy Nimbus Offline




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Posted: June 13 2010, 06:07

I've referred to it as "1000 Guitars" in the past purely as a signifier, because people know the bit you mean. We could debate for ages about how after so much bouncing, some would be so degraded as to be almost inaudible and could conceivably still have been recorded as part of a fit of over-the-topness.

but I agree this is unlikely.

Doesn't he claim something like 1948 guitars at the start of Ommadawn Side 2 as well?

Sorry - this probably isn't actually the place for this discussion. What I mean to say is: I was a bit disappointed by the end of part 1 2010 as well, but I dot' know if that's because I was expecting something bigger than was ever there in the recording. Will have to do a bit of a comparison to '75.
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Navaira Offline




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Posted: June 13 2010, 07:45

I just think 100/1000 Guitars sounds so much better than Quite A Few Guitars, Possibly Eight ;)

And the effect... I invited a friend over and we got stoned (it's legal here where I am!;) and listened to the music. The differences between the new mixes and originals had me gasping on average every minute or two -- "whoa, this... never sounded like that!". But the Quite A Few Guitars, Possibly Eight section just had both of us acting as if we were in a speeding car about to fall off the cliff; we could barely breathe, white knuckles on the arms of the sofa, and when it ended we needed to take a break, because it was so enormous.

Then I played the original Quite... section for comparison, and my friend remarked politely "yeah, that's quite big too, innit... just not so... trancey".


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