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Topic: Is it 2 bars - 7/8 & 8/8, or 1 bar of 15/8?, It doesn't matter but I still wanna know< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
larstangmark Offline




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Posted: Oct. 14 2010, 04:55

Seven, is that 3+4 or 5+2?
I think the question is purely philosophical. What consitutes a "bar" must be the intention of the composer and nothing else?
Lars T


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Ugo Offline




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Posted: Oct. 14 2010, 17:47

@ lars: as far as I know, "bars" in music are estabilished patterns - estabilished a very long time before TB. Of course you could write the whole of the TB "introduction" theme as two very long bars of 15/8, but the fact that 7/8 and 9/8 bars have existed for a very long time before TB, and have become quite extensively used in classical music and some popular music as well (while 15/8 bars have not), has naturally brought music transcribers and sheet music compilers to write out the TB theme as 7/8 + 7/8 + 7/8 + 9/8. As I said above, the whole thing could be also written as two bars of 5/4 (because 30/8 simplifies to 5/4), but writing it as four bars of octave notes is clearer, and it hightlights the fact that the notes are all of the same duration, and quite fast. Obviously, composers may be totally free not to write their music in sensibly-timed bars (ever heard of rubato?) but when music gets transcribed in official notation, whoever transcribes it always tries to bring it into common (or at least musically sensible) patterns.

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Sir Mustapha Offline




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Posted: Oct. 14 2010, 22:33

I honestly don't see the intro as 7/8 + 7/8 + 7/8 + 9/8. Yes, the piano riff can sound like that, but the bass line doesn't! The bass sounds like a more simple 7/4 + 8/4. But I agree with Lars: as formal and rigorous as you want to be with technical definitions, sometimes the artist's intentions simply differ -- and even the listener's perception does. I'm quite confident that different people "feel" certain rhythms differently. I think the bars and time signatures sometimes just don't matter at all.

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larstangmark Offline




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Posted: Oct. 15 2010, 02:58

If anyone is familiar with Pink Floyd's "Burning Bridges" (from the Obscured by Clouds album), let's take that as an example:

If you think that the meter is 4+2 then you hear a slow folk tune with an odd signature, if you think 3+3 then  you hear something else (a more ordinary waltz-like tune).

Lars T


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DelfĂ­n Offline




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Posted: Oct. 15 2010, 19:30

Quote (Ugo @ Mar. 10 2010, 00:36)
The time signature of the "Introduction" piece changes all the way through it. The main piano figure is 7/8, 7/8, 7/8, 9/8. But when the second piano enters, playing block chords, the whole thing goes into straight 3/4 and keeps like that for a while; when the second piano stops playing, the 7/8-7/8-7/8-9/8 structure resumes. Then, of course, when the 'double' guitar solo starts (at about 4:00), it goes into 4/4. And what I like to call the 'triumphant' theme, i.e. straight after the Taped Motor Drive Amplified Organ Chord, is 5/4. After that, past the "Introduction", when the main piano theme resumes after the noisy "Fast Guitars" bit and the "Basses" theme (i.e. in the section called "Latin" on TB 2003), it may sound like it's 7/8 + 7/8 + 7/8 + 9/8 again, but it's really 5/4. And when it comes to "Blues" it has somehow metamorphosed into 12/8. :) Of course I don't think about all this when I'm actually listening to the music, but the multiple time signatures give me a feeling of restlessness, of un-quietness - which I guess is what Mike was after. By comparison, "Sentinel", which starts in 4/4 and stays in 4/4 almost all of the way through, sounds much more "pop" to my ears. But I love it. :D

Awesome sharing, Ugo. Even being you.



(hahaha, just joking). :p  :/  :p  :cool:  :p


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