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Topic: Amazon review of MoTS, Have you reviewed it yet?< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
Sir Mustapha Offline




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Posted: Mar. 24 2008, 15:31

Quote (Harmono @ Mar. 24 2008, 12:07)
That's too bad, I was about to listen to your Big Robot, Little Robot album again, as I didn't download it in its entirety. I hope you come to your senses soon.  ;)

Ah, I was talking about my music reviews site, which was hosted somewhere else. My own music site is still up and running, thankfully. :)

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I'm sure we all do that, but surely it wont take long for it to dissolve from ones mind and become fresh again. Also, a solemn album, like you put it, is never good for daily consumption. I couldn't listen to Sibelius' or Beethoven's symphonies every day, but when I do, it's usually great.


That's true. It's an album to be listened to with care. Some of the most important details might fly right past our ears as we get used to them, and all it takes is a bit of time and reconditioning to truly grasp those really rewarding moments (like when Aurora calmly dissolves into that choir before Prophecy comes up - that's a really beautiful moment).


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Alan D Offline




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Posted: Mar. 24 2008, 17:21

Quote (Sir Mustapha @ Mar. 24 2008, 12:58)
I don't hate the album. I don't even dislike it, and I don't think I can consider myself "neutral" to it. What I say is that I don't consider it a "masterpiece".
That's not so far from the way I see it too. I think I like it more than you do, but I agree that it isn't a masterpiece.

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The music here at times is borderline corny
Yes (though we might differ about where we think the corny bits are).

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But, no matter how many cheesy/over-the-top/contrived moments there may be here (believe me, there aren't many), the album succeeds based on the power of the melodies alone.
Bang on. It does. It is bursting with melodies.

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Finally, the importance of melodies are rediscovered here ... and as much as Harbinger is a Tubular Bells rip-off (hate me if you will), the melody works.
It certainly does. You'd expect me to quibble about the use of the word 'rip-off', and I do - but essentially we agree on its success.

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Either way, I feel good with the album. I don't know if it's as good as it could have been, but it surely is good enough.
I feel good about it too. There are a couple of things I'd like to have seen done differently, but yes, it is good enough.

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And I feel uncomfortable with it being billed a "classical album", to the extent of Wikipedia listing it outside his "canonical" discography; it's a Mike Oldfield album like every other.
I share your discomfort. I feel as uneasy about billing it a 'classical' album as I would billing any other MO album as a 'classical' piece (they nearly all straddle the boundaries, and so does this one). This one just happens to be played by an orchestra.

Crikey Sir M! I might quibble with you over some of the detail, but I agree with virtually all your main points!

Should you be worried?
Should I be worried?
Should we both be worried?
Or have we just been absorbed into the musical harmony of the spheres?
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raven4x4x Offline




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Posted: Mar. 24 2008, 23:36

My copy arrived in the mail about an hour ago, and I've just finished listening to it for the first time. Obviously I can't make any definitive statements just yet, but I can say that it's very nice. Will I end up considering it a masterpiece to rival Amarok and TSODE? Probably not, but I think I'll end up liking it. It has the potential to be my favourite album of his since TB3.

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Harmono Offline




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Posted: Mar. 25 2008, 05:05

Quote (Sir Mustapha @ Mar. 24 2008, 21:31)
Ah, I was talking about my music reviews site, which was hosted somewhere else. My own music site is still up and running, thankfully. :)

Good, but it does seem to be down at the moment and has been at
least 12 hours now.
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Alan D Offline




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Posted: Mar. 25 2008, 16:52

I've been putting off writing something about Music of the Spheres because I found myself juggling a number of thoughts that seemed inconsistent, and I hoped the inconsistencies would resolve themselves. But they haven't, yet. So I thought I'd write a few things regardless. Maybe doing so will help me to sort a few things out.

First, and most important: I think it's a lovely album, and 'lovely' is the best word I can think of to fit it. It's bursting with melody right from the word 'go', and I don't find a single part of it dull. I think he made a very wise decision at the outset, by deciding on a structure that he knew he could control. That structure, coupled with the obvious reference to the TB theme, gives him a solid base - which surely prevented him from falling into the trap Paul McCartney did, with his overlong, overblown Standing Stone. I think MOTS is just the right length - it achieves a symphonic sense of scale at around 45 minutes, but avoids becoming too expansive and spreading itself too thinly. In fact, I'm amazed by how fast those 45 minutes go by.

But if that remains my over-riding feeling about the album, I do have a few misgivings/uncertainties. First - I'm concerned that I like it too much, and too easily. Any classical piece that approaches the stature of a symphony always taxes me on first hearing. Even if it catches my interest, it still takes me three listenings to start to feel my way into it, and even then there are huge gaps where I feel the territory is largely unexplored. This didn't happen with Music of the Spheres. I liked it very much, first time through. I picked up more detail the second time, and a bit more after that - and I'm sure that will continue in bits for a while yet; but I don't get that sense of a great unexplored territory lying ahead. I feel that MOTS is something I'll be able to return to with great pleasure a very large number of times, but I don't think it will extend me, or help me to grow.

There's one part of MOTS that I feel very uneasy about - and I feel even more uneasy because I know that for many people, this bit is a highpoint of the album. In an album which is so unfailingly 'nice', Hayley Westenra's performance of 'On My Heart' is, for me, a spoonful of sugar too many. I can stay with it for a minute or two, as it teeters on the brink of sentimentality; but then the chorus comes in towards the end, and the teetering becomes a headlong plunge into Disneyland, crocodile tears, and 'when you wish upon a star'. Maybe I'm bringing too much personal baggage to this, because I know how many people love this piece; but I really struggle to cope with its cloying sentimentality. I would love to hear a version of this sung by a soprano of more controlled power, and less sweetness - and without, oh please, without, the heavenly choir.

When I first heard Mike Oldfield (through 'Boxed' in 1979), I felt that I'd discovered someone who was writing a new kind of classical music that demanded the kind of listening that I normally gave to someone like Vaughan Williams. What was so exhilarating was that he was doing this in a new way, his own way, with a completely fresh approach to instrumentation. I think he's carried on doing these experiments right the way through to the present, producing a great range of work some of which I loved, and some of which disappointed - but it was always his unique take. With MOTS, he's at last attempted to do the Mike Oldfield 'thing' with a traditional orchestra - and yes it's lovely, and yes it's distinctively Mike Oldfield, but it does immediately make me compare what he's done with what others have done with an orchestra. Up to now he's had his own field - the Mike Oldfield instrumentation field - virtually to himself. But now he's up against the big guys, and lovely though this music is, I worry that it feels a bit lightweight. He's been the biggest fish in his own musical pool all this time. Here, in this great classical ocean, he seems smaller.

I think Sir Mustapha broadly has it right when he says that to label this as a 'classical' album is to do it no favours. It's better regarded as a Mike Oldfield album, made with an orchestra: a lovely experiment, with some thrilling moments, bringing great pleasure to lots and lots of people, me included. We've had a wide range of superbly cooked savoury dishes down the years, and now we're getting the dessert. Delicious.

I wonder what the cheese and biscuits will be like?
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Sir Mustapha Offline




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Posted: Mar. 25 2008, 23:16

Goodness gracious, help me out here, but I found myself agreeing with virtually everything you said also. Something is happening... is the world distorting?...

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In an album which is so unfailingly 'nice', Hayley Westenra's performance of 'On My Heart' is, for me, a spoonful of sugar too many. I can stay with it for a minute or two, as it teeters on the brink of sentimentality; but then the chorus comes in towards the end, and the teetering becomes a headlong plunge into Disneyland, crocodile tears, and 'when you wish upon a star'


A ha!! There! The bit of disagreement that could send us into a spiral of arguments and counter-arguments. The world is safe. :D ... well, maybe not entirely. I completely understand the sentiment there. I think I, however, have a higher "corn syrup" tolerance when the melody is solid enough. I'm the one who sends Oldfield's most bombastic 90's efforts down in flames and melts into a puddle upon hearing the Flaming Lips' "Do You Realize??", after all...

Overall, I find your post is very poignant and spot-on. Music of the Spheres will probably go down as a "humble offering" to the classical universe from a guy who sure knows what he plays. If his ambitions will get higher and he tries to delve deeper into this genre, this album will still retain its special charm.


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AlexS Offline




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Posted: Mar. 26 2008, 05:41

My review is up on Amazon's page now. Though I want to go back and give it 5 stars rather than the 4 I originally gave it!

It really is getting some glowing reviews - only a small number of miserable old farts, clearly still stuck in 1973 have given it  poor reviews.


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Dirk Star Offline




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Posted: Mar. 26 2008, 06:38

Great review Alan,and a very honest one as well.I don`t really know or like enough classical music to comment to much here but I`d just like to raise a couple of points..Firstly you mention that normally it takes you a number of listens before you can fully appreciate a classical work on a symphonic scale as such.I`m just wondering how long albums like Incantations/Ommadawn and Amarok took before you appreciated them to their full extent?I know for myself personally it took me an awfully long time before I really "got" side four of Incantations.And now it`s probablly my favourite part of that entire work.

I suppose what I`m trying to say in a roundabout way is that it is still essentially an album where Mike is in his own kind of field really.In all reality it`s probablly as much as a classical album as TB 3 was a trance album.To my ears there was still way too much going on during Tres Lunas for that to be solely classed as a chill-out album as well.Obviously over these last 10-15 years or so Mike has simplified his whole approach to music anyway.Plus we are all of us now more than familiar with the main kind of themes Mike likes to employ.I can fully appreciate your viewpoint here,and the kind of comparisons you probablly can`t help but make.But at this stage of Mike`s career is MOTS any more or less than you expected I wonder?I think on the whole I completely agree with a good deal of what you`re saying,and that perhaps the only thing missing from this album as good as it is was the unexpected.As you yourself put it.."that sense of a great unexplored territory lying ahead."For myself personally I don`t think that`s quite there in Mike`s work anymore,and has`nt been for some time in fact.I don`t want to go to much further than that really,because I still get a hell of an emotional kick out of a lot of stuff that Mike puts out.It`s just that IMO whether this album had been classical/trance or psychobilly skiffle I`d have been very suprised if that`s ever gonna` change now.

Anyway secondly I`m just so.. so..SO  pleased that Mike did`nt use a soprano/baritone/metronome or any other kind of melodramatic throat warbler for On My Heart.As I have such an aversion to Opera of almost any kind whatsoever to the extent that it almost makes me physically ill in fact.I can kind of take choral music fine,and find a good deal of it very spiritually rewarding,despite being a confirmed agnostic.But honestly you can give me Disneyland and cloying sentimentality over opera any day and I may even accept it for what it is.Even though in truth I don`t.The mere thought of Mike putting together an Opera of some kind quite frankly fills me with dreaded fear.And I dare say that`s probablly now a more realistic possibility than it`s ever been before.       :/  :O
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Alan D Offline




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Posted: Mar. 26 2008, 12:36

Quote (Dirk Star @ Mar. 26 2008, 10:38)
you mention that normally it takes you a number of listens before you can fully appreciate a classical work on a symphonic scale as such.I`m just wondering how long albums like Incantations/Ommadawn and Amarok took before you appreciated them to their full extent?

I think the quality of those albums is such that I probably still haven't appreciated them to their full extent. Amarok, certainly not - I've been struggling to come to grips with that since 1991 and I'm still trailing behind it trying to keep up!

I think I'm probably slower on the uptake than average, when listening for the first time to anything that's demanding - and that 'three listenings' rule of thumb is just my personal yardstick. The reason I mentioned it is because on the whole, I find that things I like immediately tend not to wear well, though there are exceptions of course.

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I suppose what I`m trying to say in a roundabout way is that it is still essentially an album where Mike is in his own kind of field really.

Yes, I agree with that. That's pretty much the conclusion I reached at the end of my post. The confusion arises because Mike himself described it as - and it's been touted as being - a classical piece. I think we're both discovering that may not be the best way to look at it.

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To my ears there was still way too much going on during Tres Lunas for that to be solely classed as a chill-out album as well.

I've been banging on for years about the sophistication of Tr3sLunas as a composite art form, in which the game and the music form a new kind of symbiotic entity, though I haven't persuaded many people I think. So I'm happy to go along with what you say here.

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perhaps the only thing missing from this album as good as it is was the unexpected.As you yourself put it.."that sense of a great unexplored territory lying ahead."

Yes, this is the key point, for me. There are pieces of music that are old favourites, to which I turn for pleasure, but which don't extend my perceptions, or 'state of being' much, if at all. But there are other pieces that change me forever: they're like vast doors, opening onto strange and apparently limitless landscapes. Elgar's symphonies are like that for me. I will never get to the bottom of them in a lifetime of listening. When Mike Oldfield says, 'I have written a classical work' - that's the kind of thing I'm going to be hoping for (even though the hope may not be entirely realistic). To continue the meal analogy: I was hoping for another main course, but got a delicious dessert instead. I'm not going to complain about that.

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For myself personally I don`t think that`s quite there in Mike`s work anymore,and has`nt been for some time in fact.

I haven't given up on him, because it was there in Tr3sLunas (i.e. game+music), as I mentioned above. (The fact that it was unpopular doesn't mean that the exploratory impulse wasn't there.) So I've no evidence to suppose he's no longer capable of it.

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Anyway secondly I`m just so.. so..SO  pleased that Mike did`nt use a soprano/baritone/metronome or any other kind of melodramatic throat warbler for On My Heart.As I have such an aversion to Opera of almost any kind whatsoever to the extent that it almost makes me physically ill in fact.

Well, you're going a lot further there than I intended. Hayley Westenra is herself a soprano, after all - so my use of the word wasn't particularly controversial I think. But certainly I wasn't proposing 'MOTS- The Opera', and certainly any hint of melodrama would entirely destroy the piece, as you say. I think the kind of shrieking you're imagining is a million miles from what I was asking for - which is a little more vocal control, and a little more power, and a little less treacle. It's a very fine balance, here on this border between the poignant and the sentimental, and different people draw the line in slightly different places - though one person's fine adjustment can have the effect of a bulldozer for someone else.
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Sweetpea Offline




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Posted: Mar. 26 2008, 16:01

Quote (Sir Mustapha @ Mar. 24 2008, 08:58)
The music here at times is borderline corny (Silhouette), at times borderline Wizard of Oz (the end of Prophecy)

I don't hear the "borderline corny" or "borderline Wizard of Oz" qualities in those pieces, but I detect both in "Aurora".

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I couldn't care less about how "emotional" or "spiritual" this sounds (the concept can bite me - I like my music mundane and carnal)

Sir M, are you saying that you find MOTS "mundane and carnal"? I usually prefer mundane & carnal over emotional & spiritual, but I don't find much of it in MOTS. That might be why Music of the Spheres tends to remind me of The Songs of Distant Earth.

Quote (Alan D @ Mar. 25 2008, 16:52)
Hayley Westenra's performance of 'On My Heart' is, for me, a spoonful of sugar too many. I can stay with it for a minute or two, as it teeters on the brink of sentimentality; but then the chorus comes in towards the end, and the teetering becomes a headlong plunge into Disneyland, crocodile tears, and 'when you wish upon a star'.

Alan, I'm with Sir M when he describes "On My Heart" as 'honest' and 'beautiful', so although it's not my favorite part (there are more attractive melodies), I can't fault it either. As for Hayley's performance, I think she has a really lovely voice that works well with the music. I often prefer a more mature voice with a touch of gravitas, but I'm not sure it would compliment MOTS. If I were to pick a sugary, 'Disneyland' moment, it would be "Aurora". Now, it sounds like I'm picking on that track, but I actually like it!

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lovely though this music is, I worry that it feels a bit lightweight.

I'm a lover of light music, but with MOTS I did notice a lack of darker passions. Still, I think it's just the character of the work and it makes sense, to me, for it to be more ethereal than earthly.

So, I agree with several of your points, Sir M and Alan, but I'd still rate MOTS as a five-star work.


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Alan D Offline




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Posted: Mar. 26 2008, 17:27

Quote (Sweetpea @ Mar. 26 2008, 20:01)
Still, I think it's just the character of the work and it makes sense, to me, for it to be more ethereal than earthly.

Just to clarify: 'ethereal' wouldn't have troubled me at all - like you, I would expect to encounter ethereality in a piece with this title. I meant lightweight in the sense of 'dessert' rather than 'main course': very fine in its way, provided you don't dig too deep. [Don't think I'm knocking puddings: I'd be capable of terrible crimes to get the last helping of tiramisu.]

On the 'Disneyland' comment - I used the word not in a pejorative sense, necessarily (though I admit Disneyfication does make me shudder quite a lot), but more as a literal descriptive term. That particular moment (when the chorus comes in after Hayley) does sound, to me, very like something from 'Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs'. That's the precise moment when my struggle to take it seriously collapses.

But I do readily admit, as I've already said, that the line between poignancy and mawkishness is very difficult to negotiate. Pre-Raphaelite paintings often sit on this uncertain borderline, where one person may be deeply moved, while another would experience revulsion at what's perceived as sentimentality.
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3Wheeler Offline




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Posted: Mar. 26 2008, 17:46

Yeah Id Like to Hear a Male Vocal ie a Quality one  .. Groban etc singing the Song just to Compare the Two Versions.. Im Convinced it would sound Fantastic as Well ..!! :cool:

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Sir Mustapha Offline




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Posted: Mar. 26 2008, 20:55

Quote (Sweetpea @ Mar. 26 2008, 16:01)
Sir M, are you saying that you find MOTS "mundane and carnal"? I usually prefer mundane & carnal over emotional & spiritual, but I don't find much of it in MOTS. That might be why Music of the Spheres tends to remind me of The Songs of Distant Earth.

On the contrary. "Earthly and carnal" is how I generally like music, and that's the exact opposite of what Mike attempted here. Yet, the music is so good that I don't really mind.

I would mind if the music for me didn't succeed. I just don't share the opinion that music should be mystical and supernatural and spiritual and all that; partly because I'm a sceptic, partly because I think a human being is fully responsible for his creativity and inspiration. But that's for another topic; what matters here is that I really like the music here, regardless of what Mike intended it to be.


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Sweetpea Offline




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Posted: Mar. 27 2008, 03:17

Quote (Alan D @ Mar. 26 2008, 17:27)
Just to clarify: 'ethereal' wouldn't have troubled me at all - like you, I would expect to encounter ethereality in a piece with this title. I meant lightweight in the sense of 'dessert' rather than 'main course': very fine in its way, provided you don't dig too deep. [Don't think I'm knocking puddings: I'd be capable of terrible crimes to get the last helping of tiramisu.]

I think I see what you mean, Alan. While it's great when a piece of art is a full meal experience, a musical dish needn't necessarily satisfy all of one's cravings. As you've suggested, it can be an appetizer, a main course, a cheese platter, or a dessert. As long as it's delicious in itself, it's a success. Please forgive me... I've just been watching "Top Chef", but I also simply love to talk about food.

Quote (Sir Mustapha @ Mar. 26 2008, 20:55)
On the contrary. "Earthly and carnal" is how I generally like music, and that's the exact opposite of what Mike attempted here. Yet, the music is so good that I don't really mind.

Thanks for clearing up my confusion, Sir M. I see that I'd misread your post; it makes much more sense, now.

Quote (3Wheeler @ Mar. 26 2008, 17:46)
Id Like to Hear a Male Vocal ie a Quality one  .. Groban etc singing the Song just to Compare the Two Versions.. Im Convinced it would sound Fantastic as Well ..!!

3Wheeler, I'm not sure about a male "On My Heart", but I would like to hear Mike use a male choir some time.


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Ugo Offline




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Posted: Mar. 27 2008, 04:38

Quote (Sweetpea @ Mar. 27 2008, 09:17)
3Wheeler, I'm not sure about a male "On My Heart", but I would like to hear Mike use a male choir some time.

He did... on Hibernaculum. :D I'd prefer him not to... male choirs, to me, sound either boring (like on Hibernaculum) or with gay overtones (as in Pet Shop Boys' Go West). And you wouldn't want Mike's music to have gay overtones, would you? :laugh:


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Dirk Star Offline




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Posted: Mar. 27 2008, 06:47

Thanks for the reply Alan,much appreciated.And yes you`re right I did get carried away a bit with the whole opera thing for a moment there.That sudden irrational fear of Tubular Bells the opera sent me spiraling out of control I guess.I think I`m with Sir M on this one though,as I certainly did`nt feel that Mike had over-stepped any of my own thresholds of over sentimentality there.Like you say though it`s a fine balance,I agree.There are a countless number of laid on with a trowel fests out there that I`d simply love to bulldoze through that`s for sure.Perhaps On My Heart is a little bit guilty of some over lavish trowel work there I`d maybe concede that.But to me it pretty much had that same dis-arming effect on me as something like On Horseback.That`s just my own take on it anyway.

I`d just like to elaborate a little bit on something you did`nt pick up on there.And that was the point I was trying to get at when I mentioned our own familiarity with the main kind of themes Mike likes to employ anyway.One of the few classical composers I`ve become a little bit familiar with in recent years is Gustav Mahler.This all basically came about with a good friend of mine`s persistance with getting me to listen to his work really.And eventually with a whole lot of persistance from myself I may add I grew to really love and appreciate his music.Now of course I had to start with the 5th symphony apparently as I was told to do so point blank in fact."If you don`t enjoy listening to this you may as well pack in listening to music now."I was told..

Well I must admit there was some sections of that piece that I initially just did`nt get at all.And it took me numerous listens before I started to kind of adjust myself to it is the best way I can think of to describe it here.But once I did get there it was just such an exhilerating rush listening to it sometimes I can`t really describe it at all.Now obviously the knock on effect of that was that other pieces of music that I`ve subsequently delved into of Mahler`s did`nt really have that same initial effect on me really.I`ve enjoyed many of them,no question.But Imo a lot of our own discoveries do become less so anyway partially due to our own familiarity with the artist.None of us can help being Mike afficanados after all.

If I`m being truly honest the whole classical tag does bother me a bit as well Alan.You know despite the fact that I have a very limited understanding of classical music.I don`t subscribe to the point of view that.."oh those classical guys will only look down upon it because it`s somebody from a rock/popular field."Those kind of people of a more classical leaning are fully entitled to their opinion I think.And it would be a little crass to say the least for someone like me to suggest otherwise.One thing about Mike Oldfield of course is his great ear for a melody I suppose.He was really the first guy of any real significance to take those minimalist/repetetive influences from the likes of Steve Reich and Phillip Glass and turn them into highly melodic uplifting pieces of simplistic genius in their own right.For me something like Aurora from MOTS fits that bill perfectly I guess.Now to a degree I can see how that can maybe wrangle with a lot of people from a more classical background.All that celtically influenced stuff has always been a big no no in a lot of classical circles as well has`nt it.I can see a perspective where some of those guys will say "Oh he`s just pandering to the masses again"But in all honesty I don`t agree with that at all.To me that`s just the way Mike is, the man speaks from his soul as far as I`m concerned and to hell with all the bloody consequences.

Well I don`t know if I`m making too much sense there with all those contradictions going on as usual.And I don`t think it really changes my overall feeling about MOTS in general.Nor do I expect it to change any of your own Alan.I thought I`d just try and explain some of my own reasoning I went through in trying to appreciate and accept Mike`s album for how I saw it...Cheers!
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Alan D Offline




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Posted: Mar. 27 2008, 11:28

Quote (Dirk Star @ Mar. 27 2008, 10:47)
One of the few classical composers I`ve become a little bit familiar with in recent years is Gustav Mahler. ... Well I must admit there was some sections of that piece that I initially just did`nt get at all.And it took me numerous listens before I started to kind of adjust myself to it is the best way I can think of to describe it here.But once I did get there it was just such an exhilerating rush listening to it sometimes I can`t really describe it at all.Now obviously the knock on effect of that was that other pieces of music that I`ve subsequently delved into of Mahler`s did`nt really have that same initial effect on me really.

Well, I recognise and sympathise with all of this kind of response - the initial struggle, adjustment, frustration ... and then comes some measure of insight that makes the struggle worthwhile - not just the struggle that's past, but the struggle that I know still lies ahead to get into other aspects of it. I can really understand what you're saying, here.

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I`ve enjoyed many of them,no question.But Imo a lot of our own discoveries do become less so anyway partially due to our own familiarity with the artist.None of us can help being Mike afficanados after all.

I don't quite follow this. Do you mean the struggle gets easier as we get to know the artist better?

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If I`m being truly honest the whole classical tag does bother me a bit as well Alan.

This is one of those instances where it might help if we regard it as part of the marketing process, but just ignore it as far as our own listening is concerned. The 'classical' tag may well attract a heap of people who normally listen to Classic FM, say - but who wouldn't normally think of buying a Mike Oldfield album. (That can only be part of the story, because I get the impression that Mike himself really does think of it as a 'classical' album.)

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I don`t subscribe to the point of view that.."oh those classical guys will only look down upon it because it`s somebody from a rock/popular field."

Well a lot of that kind of snobbery goes on (and there's a lot of inverted snobbery the other way too, I think) - but I don't think we need trouble ourselves about that. The only really important issue is whether this person here and now, listening to this piece of music, is having a life-enriching experience - no matter who he or she is, and no matter what label is attached to the piece. And I think we're all in agreement that it's possible to have a very life-enriching experience listening to Music of the Spheres, no matter what label we choose to put on it.

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All that celtically influenced stuff has always been a big no no in a lot of classical circles as well has`nt it.I can see a perspective where some of those guys will say "Oh he`s just pandering to the masses again"But in all honesty I don`t agree with that at all.

Well, I'm with you on that. One of the wonderful things about composers like Elgar and Vaughan Williams is that they have always been popular with ordinary people, even though they've taken a lot of knocks from critics (who sometimes seem more concerned about demonstrating their own cleverness, and their elite point of view, than really engaging with the music).

There's nothing wrong with turning out memorably great tunes - and Mike can turn out great tunes along with the best of them, and Music of the Spheres is packed with 'em. That's far, far more important than any personal quibbles I might have about this or that bit that doesn't quite suit my taste!
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Bassman Offline




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Posted: Mar. 27 2008, 13:24

Bet you any money that ELP comes out with a "rock" version of it.

And then Andrew Lloyd Webber creates "TB-The Musical".
Libretto by Richard Branson.
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Dirk Star Offline




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Posted: Mar. 28 2008, 07:29

[quote=Alan D,Mar. 27 2008, 11:28]
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Well a lot of that kind of snobbery goes on (and there's a lot of inverted snobbery the other way too, I think)


Well I agree with that completely there is a lot of snobbery in music inverted or otherwise.And I think I alluded to that a little bit with my referance to celtic influences etc.Part of my problem though is my own ignorance really to a great deal of classical music on the whole.So to a large degree my own counter arguements are very limited to anyone with a much broader knowledge of the genre.That`s really all I was trying to say there.I think that`s why I was very curious to hear your own personal take on the album,and some of your own reasoning behind that.Especially given the fact that we seem to have drawn a lot of similar conclusions over this album.


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I don't quite follow this. Do you mean the struggle gets easier as we get to know the artist better?


Well yes that`s exactly what I meant to a degree.Maybe I`m talking more about stylistic traits rather than the content of the music itself.I was just trying to look at another possible flipside to the fact that we both found MOTS very easy to listen to,and instantly likeable.Although despite that I think that we`re both in agreement that MOTS does`nt really contain the same depth of some of Mike`s earlier works.

You mention Vaugan Williams there who is somebody I`ve listened to a little bit.Now I`m digging in the memory banks a bit here but I think the first piece I ever heard of his was The Lark In The Morning or The Lark Ascending???Those are possiblly two different pieces entirely I`m not quite sure now.Anyway I do remember liking his music immediatly.I was probablly listening to some kind of budget classical compilation belonging to my father and without doubt I can remember that one standing out a mile to me straight away.Despite that though there was sections of that piece where I`d find myself switching off a little bit.So in my own way I`d immediatly put that down to something that was more of the time I suppose.And it would take me quite a while before I could first of all accept it musically.And then kind of translate that acceptance emotionally.So eureka the penny finally drops we`re actually getting somewhere here.I`d be thinking to myself.

Not long after that I can remember putting together a tape of some Vaughan Williams compositions from my father`s record collection.Which I must`ve played a countless number of times over a period of six months or so because eventually it ended up mangled beyond repair and stuck in the tape deck.The thing was though when I subsequently first heard all those other compositions of his on that tape.I found myself switching off again sometimes because I was often aware of what was coming next.Obviously with repeated listens I picked up on different things more and more,but that first kind of initial rush of a breakthrough does tend to fade a little bit imo.I will add though that talking about that tape here has probablly rekindled some of my own curiosity in going through that whole Vaughan Williams discovery trip once again.

The thing is for all of us listening to MOTS its all too easy to sometimes go.."Oh yeah that bits Incantations or that bits The Wind Chimes etc etc.."And then for me anyway part of me switches off to it a little bit.Again with repeated listens I`ll find myself picking up on things that a part of me might have dismissed a little bit initially.Now I know that sounds like I`m putting forward a reverse arguement to my point here.And that some of our own familiarity with Mike Oldfield the artist actually hinders some of our own appreciation of his music in fact.I think that`s what I was trying to drive at initially really.But it`s also something of a double edged sword as well.So while our own familiarity with Mike Oldfield can help us appreciate a work like MOTS almost immediatly.There`s maybe still a good deal of listening to be done yet before we can give it it`s full justice.
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ommadawn,ah!ooh! Offline




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Posted: Mar. 28 2008, 09:48

Know what? I'd love to know messrs. Newman,Heyworth and Bedford's opinion of MotS...What say you?
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