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Topic: Taurus 2, A surprising lack of a cover..< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
dbruce Offline




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Posted: Mar. 16 2004, 04:39

I'm getting to grips pretty well with the lead part now, with exception of the trading solos part, which to be honest I've not had a good stab at yet. All I've figured out is the rough chord sequence - some kind of strange cycle of fifths style progression? Anyway, I'll work on that soon.

Re. your plan of 'who plays what', for the first section (up to around 2:00), I'll just play the barred chords in the background. There are quite a few guitars there from what I can hear, so I'd rather beef up the sound! :)

How about the duck-hunting section (as I like to call it) - we leaving that to our synth guys? Then the famous bagpipe guitar sound? (Sorry I don't have timings - I'm at uni and don't have the CD to hand)

If we're able to get a female vocalist I wouldn't mind carrying on up to the climax at around 12:00. But one step at a time, eh!

David
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MusicallyInspired Offline




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Posted: Mar. 16 2004, 09:17

What's the duck hunting section? I'm not sure which part you mean. And the bagpipe part can be both guitar and a synth sound of some kind whether we can get a bagpipe sound or not.

And hey if you're having trouble, I can tab some stuff out for you.


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dbruce Offline




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Posted: Mar. 16 2004, 09:24

Sorry - should've maybe been a little more descriptive!! I was meaning the section starting around 6:30 running up to where the bagpipe guitars come in around 8:00. I think it's the Uileann Pipes playing the melody. I think the track layout in the FMO sleeve calls it "Morris Men" or something like that - but I've always pictured someone out duck-hunting, for some random reason!!  :D

David
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MusicallyInspired Offline




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Posted: Mar. 16 2004, 18:18

You're times seem to be different than mine. 6:30 on mine starts in the middle of the pipes section and 8:00 is when it ends...Do you mean the part where the guitar plays the pipe's theme right before the pipes play it? Or are you talking about the live version?

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Jammer Offline




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Posted: Mar. 22 2004, 18:26

22nd March - First update of the project!

I haven't forgotten about it. For the last three or so days I have been working hard on the drum track from the first two minutes.

Firstly I made an analysis of the tempi used in the section we are doing. It's fairly simple. After this the actual transcribing work began.

Despite having an almost top-of-the-range studio quality sound module, I resorted to using a sampled drum kit as this way the samples are not muddied by too much reverb and other effects. I played around with the snare drum, a few toms and the opening click samples in particular to get them truer to the original sound. I am not sure about the resonance of the toms and the overall 'melodic' pitches inherent in some of the crash cymbals. This will present greater problems in later passages, but it's worth remembering that the drums will be low in the mix under the other parts

I put the sampler through some compression, low-cut EQ and most clearly a delay unit that is very significant in the original (all software of course :) )

Brandon: Do you think there should be a website about this group project? That way all the files and latest news etc. are in one place. We'll continue to use this forum, but it might be easier and clearer with a website too

Here's my work so far as an ogg file at 0.50 quality. Luckly the file was small as now I have an appawling 21k modem connection :zzz:

drumtrack1.ogg (918 kb)

Any comments or suggestions so far are welcome!
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MusicallyInspired Offline




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Posted: Mar. 22 2004, 20:00

Dude! Very nice!! They are almost identical to the original drums! It wasn't really my intent to do a straight copy of the original, but these are too good to get rid of now :D! Excellent! Just jamming with it now and it's quite fun! Can't wait to hear the rest!

Remember also, the song isn't just guitars bass and drums. There's some strings and other synth sounds too. Quite a lot in the first few parts, actually. If you could use your excellent synth to get some realistic-sounding strings and other sounds, we could make a Taurus 2004, instead of merely an MO cover ;).

Until the next demo, I will be jamming. hehehehehe

And about the website idea. Do you mean a server to host the files? I'm not sure I follow you. I don't see a point in have a whole website for one cover.....that is unless we covered more ;). I can host files on a server I have access to, but I can't give out login information to it because it belongs to a friend of mine.


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dbruce Offline




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Posted: Mar. 25 2004, 07:22

Drums sound really good - can't wait to get a chance to play along with them when I get home!

I'm still not having any success trying to figure out that solo (well, the half of the 'duel'), so either if you wanted to do both parts yourself, or tab it out for me? It's totally up to you, just whichever is easier.

Cheers
David
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MusicallyInspired Offline




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Posted: Mar. 25 2004, 23:41

Are you talking about the part at 4:18? If so I'll tab that out and have it ready for you. I'll mark out which parts we each play if that makes it easier.

Heh. This is unimportant, but I noticed I made a little typo in the title of this topic. I meant to write "Surprising lack of a cover" instead of "Surprising lack over a cover".

Yep.


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dbruce Offline




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Posted: Mar. 26 2004, 12:24

Cheers, Brandon - got the tab and it's helped a lot! I've played through it a few times this afternoon and I think I've got the hang of it.

I had hoped to try recording bits tonght, but I've hit a slight setback. Just as I was finishing my last run through of the solo, I looked down to see blood all over my left hand. Apparently I'd sliced the skin when i accidentally broke a coffee cup five minutes earlier and hadn't noticed. So I need to have my finger plastered all night to stop the bleeding. So unless yous want it to sound like I'm playing with broken fingers (!) I'll have to wait to record!

David (a little worried at it taking 5 minutes to notice the blood!!)
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MusicallyInspired Offline




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Posted: Mar. 26 2004, 18:44

No worries, man. We got all the time in the world. Quite a thing, though lol. I once started bleeding while playing guitar, but I'm not sure when it started. That's crazy, though lol. Glad the tab helped, too!

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Jammer Offline




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Posted: Mar. 27 2004, 10:52

27th March - Opening 2 mins completed

Here is my latest offering. I have not progressed in terms of length, but rather have been working at the same opening section. I have now completed my bit of it with synth sounds and sampled drums. I understand what you mean by cover version. Best to have it sounding from this period rather than the 80s! I have been listening to a healthy dose of Tubular 2 in order to get the right modern feel for a mix. Time to put the Digital Sound Processor to use. :)

There is slightly more reverb on the drums and some synth sounds. I used five MIDI synth tracks that were later recorded individually to audio, so that I could add the reverb and EQ. I altered the EQ on the thick bass sound so that there is a roll-off on the lowest frequencies. This allows a live bass track not to be 'swamped' in the mix

I think I am done for this section, and I'll get cracking with the next bit. I would be happy to mix the additional live guitar and bass tracks with any necessary effects and processing

For Brandon and David: The basic tempo that I worked out for this section is at 163 quaver (eigth-note) beats a  minute (though the live human error causes the original to fluctuate a bit). If you like, I could make a click track at this tempo. In later sections there are gradual ralls to different tempi - A universal click track would be necessary for these bits. As long as the project is steadily going, there is no need to rush! I'm working quite quickly because I know that I'll have considerably less time after three weeks. Plus my music setup is quite good at the moment :)

demo-opening.ogg (1.17 MB)

Note: As much as ogg compression is praised on these forums :) the quality on this demo is slightly compromised. The trumpets sound a bit raspy here, but on my 20MB wav mix they sound OK. Also the clicking isn't supposed to fade in like that, it might be because I didn't give the sequencer enough time to play first
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MusicallyInspired Offline




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Posted: Mar. 27 2004, 14:14

Very nice track! Sounds maybe a bit too synthy, though. But then that could be due to the fact that there aren't any guitars in it yet. Will sound much better with all the guitars in. Was jamming to it. It's excellent! Would also be good to add those strings like I mentioned in the final version.

Anyways, can't wait to hear the next couple minutes :).


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Jammer Offline




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Posted: April 01 2004, 17:04

1st April - an extra minute

Well I couldn't get to the four-minute mark by the end of this week. The fourth minute in this section is one of the hardest bits both in terms of drum programming and your guitar parts! so I think I'll now move on to the 'Morris Men' section. Careful programming of a monophonic synth with a bit of portamento can produce something fairly similar to the Uileann Pipes

This extra minute with the faster tempo took a while because my current drum samples weren't fit for the job. Luckly I found a better acoustic drum kit and combined this with the old one so that the sections didn't sound too different. I can now say that I played 'two completely sampled drum kits' on the list of instruments :D
The original has a very slight phaser effect on certain cymbal crashes. It took a while trying to create this effect in Logic. In the 6/8 section I did a quick bounce of a single bar of the phaser part and repeated this each bar so that the phaser started its cycle at the beginning of the bar

The tempo for this section is at 222 quavers per minute. I think the first bit before the 6/8 has a number of guitars (there are two in the live version). Towards the end of the section there is a rit back to 163 quavers per minute.

I was quite light with usage of synths this time (other than in the obvious sections). Do you think I should add any more instrumental parts to what's already there? I'm a bit reluctant to use the heavy synth bass from the previous section too soon, but could substitute it with another patch

Here's the demo. There doesn't seem to be any clear loss of quality from the encoding this time

turbulence-demo.ogg (623 kb, only 1'08")
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MusicallyInspired Offline




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Posted: April 01 2004, 19:55

AGH! The very next part is my favourite part! :) It's ok though take your time hehe.

Very nice. I would suggest adding more sounds to that. In the original there is clearly some synth playing along with the guitar parts in this section. Maybe not that big bassy synth from the beginning, but something like strings or a pad or something. I don't know. Actually wait a minute now....there is no guitars on this section in the orignial is there?! Well there will be in our version. I didn't practice playing along with it day after day for no reason :).

Excellent work, dude. Am anticipating Morris Men.


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Jammer Offline




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Posted: April 02 2004, 18:05

Yes you are right. To me it sounds like some sort of 'warm fuzz' guitar with a synth pad doubling it. This could have been a single patch on a Fairlight CMI, if Mike had it at the time, or Mike playing along with the Fairlight.

Compare the start of this section (02'01") with the start of the first (00'04") and you can hear the identical same instrument or collection of instruments used. The first section has another instrument in addition (the one with the vibrato) playing an octave up

I'm glad that you'll be putting more guitar parts in. This could be at our combined discression on what sounds right in the end. You previously said that you and David would have a go at playing the fast riff. As for 00'04" a guitar could possibly be included low down in the mix and with cut high frequencies as to not detract from when the guitar truly kicks in at around 00'15"

Which guitar section are you aiming to record first? If you like I could work on the backing especially for this specific section. I'd like to hear how the live tracks will sound all together even for just a short passage. To the 'band': Don't hesitate to submit something if you are free to work on it. Just looking at the page for the Finale project again has given me new strength to hold my heading true and get our finest out

-ahem-
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MusicallyInspired Offline




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Posted: April 03 2004, 11:52

Actually I've always thought that instrument is just a really old strings sample on old MIDI equipment. Which is why I keep envisioning what it would be like if it was real strings. Or at least passable synth strings.

And yes we're going to be doing the fast riff. All the guitar parts that are already in the orignial we are definitely doing hehe. And I like the idea of putting a new guitar at the beginning of the track underneath. Maybe a tad more fuzzy than normal, but not too much. Another idea I had was to add a guitar playing the theme in Morris Men when it builds and repeats at 7:17. Or maybe a couple guitars would work.

I'll record some guitar parts later on today. If you want to make a backing track for a specific section you want to hear the guitar(s) with, an idea could be that part at 5:37 when that theme starts. I gave that part to David to play, though. Well, it's only a practice anyway to see what the guitars will sound like. Unless he can do it, I'll just record for that part to see what it sounds like. But in the end David do it.


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dbruce Offline




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Posted: April 11 2004, 11:30

So much for me being able to record in my three weeks off! You know how it gets with other stuff getting in the way. I've still been playing through regularly though, and hope to be able to record a bit tonight.

For the bits we have drums for, the fast guitars bit (~2:00) is proving a bit fast but I'm getting there. I've been playing the melody at 2:20, which sounds not bad doubled up with the synth sound. Having trouble deciding on what sound I want to use, but once I sort that out I should be able to start the ball rolling for my part at least!

And the duelling solo is great! Can't wait till we get to building that one up!

David
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dbruce Offline




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Posted: April 12 2004, 06:47

Well I finally got some recording done last night - first three minutes. I probably won't settle on this as a final take, but I can upload it if you want to try a rough mix just now?

David
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MusicallyInspired Offline




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Posted: April 12 2004, 07:08

Sure man I'd love to hear it. Get an idea what I'm playing with.

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dbruce Offline




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Posted: April 12 2004, 07:27

Right, it's up at http://www.enigmatism.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/mp3/taur2-opening-guit2.ogg.

You'll probably prefer a different guitar sound, so just let me know what suits best! And don't worry, I'll make a better recording of it! :)

David
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