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TOBY Group: Members Posts: 1562 Joined: May 2002 Posted: June 03 2003, 12:24 Well don't go looking to Q magazine for a good review thats for sure, It gives TB2003 one star out of five. The actual review istelf doesn't contain any obsevations that haven't been posted here already, ie the new digital recording removes all the atmosphere and hand played feel of the original and that John Cleese is completely over the top as MC. Back to top

christopher Group: Members Posts: 270 Joined: Nov. 1999 Posted: June 03 2003, 18:18 Ok... now that I've had to download the whole album in order to hear it here in America... I can give an accurate review.   I had to cancel and re-order both the Complete and 2003... Amazon in America and Canada are way fucking slow and cost too much!!!  I ordered it directly from the Amazon UK... shipped out the next day... very fast they are and cost effective! Ok... I stand by my statement that TB2003 will be more likely to be dated than TB2.  And that TB2 is FAR MORE developed in melody and feel than the original melodies! However, TB2003 does bring to life some of those beautiful slow sections (Latin, Peace, Harmonics, A minor Tune) that deserve a second chance.  These sections are the most beautiful to me and they speak... no words necessary! One of my favorite sections is 'Blues' just because I like the way it builds up into this grand guitar thrashing... keeps me bopping my head... then breaks down into the pub-piano.   As for 'Thrash'... TOTAL TRASH!!  Very disappointed.  The bass in the background sounds so programmed you can see 'DATA from STar Trek' playing it!!  This was a missed opportunity.  I've heard the original and a bunch of LIVE versions where he really lets the guitar have it at this point and to see the washed out relaxed mess that has come to this track... makes me sick! Ghost Bells... although not really a melody more of a transition... is very haunting and is quite creapy without anything more than some synths and a bell. Oh yeah forgot the first three tracks, haven't I?  Introduction is nice and clear, but this track is so cliche that I usually skip right over it.  If you've heard one piano intro you've heard all three!!  snooooozing and booooooring. Although, the bit at the end of Introduction is quite pretty! Fast Guitars is very nice and I like the thrashing keyboard sound in the background... kinda like a guitar-whip... whipping to produce more and more sound.   Basses is nice too... I like the heavy over-the-top feel.  However, the drums again need some placing... he seems to have this trouble in recent years.  Drum machines eeeeek.  They are too much in the background.  Maybe this is do to the 192k quality on the sound files... which I know from previous encounters with downloading... can make something sound a bit more drab than on the CD.   (Just a note:  I DO buy CD's and only download if I like one track or until I can afford to buy it or until my copy arrives) Finale is a good track too.  Can't get used to that annoying ear piercing reed and pipe organ!!!  Should have used the same one from TB2... doesn't make my ears explode!  I don't like, however, how the track bops along at a dance beat of 4/4 and then after Cleese says 'PLUS Tubular Bells' it changes to hit the beat on 1 and 3.  Too slow for me.  These are just my preferences really. Bagpipe Guitars is very very very well done!!  This is a track I normally just skipped right over as I found it terribly annoying and too much.  Now it has this verry nice acoustic guitar in the center making it sound very Celtic... like Voyager... nice touch! And the rough drums... very nice touch! Caveman and cavewoman... Only trouble with this track is the drums!  Other than that... nicely done Mike! Ambient Guitars is a great track too.  Very expressive!  Though I did feel with the original and with the remake... that this track tends to get a little over-the-top and complicated... which takes away from the beauty. Hornpipe... well what can I say... Classic track... sounds great... great bass line... moves along... flows... just all around great ending to a great album! In the words of John Cleese - directed at MIKE OLDFIELD - "And Now for SOmething COMPLETELY DIFFERENT..." NO MORE TUBULAR BELL ALBUMS - Thanks!!   If you just have to re-record something else... try Incantations, Ommadawn, Amarok, Crises, Taurus 2... something other than a BELL album.  No MoRE Please!!   You are at the very least Mike, extremely talented... don't let it go to waste... please give us another brilliant album with absolutely NO references to TB or Tres Lunas... thanks!! Christopher Back to top

James Unregistered Posted: June 03 2003, 19:33 YEAHHHHH! What about a Taurs 2 2 if you know what I mean.Lurvely....... Back to top

MusicallyInspired Group: Musicians Posts: 1445 Joined: June 2001 Posted: June 03 2003, 20:38 You know, I had a thought. He made an album all about planes. Now he's into these model helicopter things. Why doesn't he make an album about helicopters? Perhaps achance for a Taurus 4 finally? -------------- BrandonBlume.com "The beauty in life is in the embracing of the variety of things. If all the world was blue there would be no colour blue." Back to top

christopher Group: Members Posts: 270 Joined: Nov. 1999 Posted: June 03 2003, 23:08 I guess what I am wishing for in Mike is an album of pure substance.  Like TSODE or even Voyager.  Hell, even Guitars was good.  Tres Lunas wasn't as bad as many of us make it out to be.  But, it isn't what I'd say a very note worthy album... basically I believe Mike could have blinked and created an album like Tres LUnas... takes no time and energy really... he had his talent into the game instead of the music.  Hopefully that won't happen again! Mike is so good at making instrumental melodies that evoke emotion... Amarok is great example.  Tubular Bells has been a good example but HIGHLY OVER USED!  Ommadawn and Voyager... all good examples of what Mike can do.   I guess I'd like to see more of an 80's Mike... with vocals and the whole band thing again.  Probably wishing upon a star to make that happen.  Mike is getting older and probably doesn't want much to do with all the flashy 80's stuff... however NOW would be a good time to try and recapture that time period since it is rather popular again... before it PASSES HIM BY again! The way I look at it is... if Mick Jagger can swing those hips at 50+ and still capture a crowd... so can Mike Oldfield... he's jsut got to put in the effort like Mick and the Walking Dead (I mean Keith Richards ) and Elton John.  Even Santana is still going strong... it's all about your approach and Mike needs to get his credibility back!  That means no more of the BELL... NO MORE MIKE... you are NOT a one-hit-wonder and we don't want you to be remembered as one!!!! Christopher Back to top

Dude Group: Members Posts: 73 Joined: June 2003 Posted: June 05 2003, 09:35 Nicely spoken, Christopher. I think most fans will agree with you. I wasn't waiting for a re-recording of TB, but now I've heard it, I'm glad Mike did it. I liked only the first 17 minutes of the original TB, whereas I like the first 46 minutes of TB 2003! (still don't care about that hornpipe-tune). And I think Cleese is the ultimate Master of Ceremonies. Regarding the circumstances in 1973, I understand why Mike wanted to re-record TB, but let's leave it at that. No more bells, no more re-recordings. Anyone waiting for 'Hergest Ridge 2004'? Don't think so. -------------- Fortunately I've been adhering to a pretty strict drug regimen to keep my mind limber. Back to top

TOBY Group: Members Posts: 1562 Joined: May 2002 Posted: June 05 2003, 13:20 I agree with Christopher in so much as I think Mike should stick to what he's good at and channel his considerable talents intead of spreading them thinly over a lot of different areas. If he's going to continue the Voyager/TB3/Guitars patern of making music then I would certainly give up hope. Personaly I think most of the music he wrote for the MVR project was much, much more momorable than any of the albums mentioned above, give or take a few good tracks, Mont SaintMichel, Far Above the Clouds (a rewrite after all)  and Summit Day. I think that 80's revival of which you speak has already passed him by, it was about 2 years ago after all, and anyway it was mainly in dance music. The 80's style songwriting of which Mike was a real devotee, AOR, MOR, has never really made a comeback, thankfully some might say. Like us all I hope Mike goes back to writing good, developed, emotional instrumental music before he's written off completely by both his fans and the world at large. Back to the original topic. This months Uncut magazine has a positive review of TB2003, doesn't really say anything new but gives it a fair 3 stars out of five, there's a nice short interview aswell. At least there's still some interest here in the UK but I'm still shocked there's been so little. Back to top

christopher Group: Members Posts: 270 Joined: Nov. 1999 Posted: June 05 2003, 16:37 Toby and Dude thank you for your kind words! Toby what is AOR, MOR? You are probably right - the 80's style that Mike wrote in is not quite fashionable again... but he can grasp onto the area that is in a comeback and write.  Hell, if he just went ahead and wrote in his old 80's style it would probably make a comeback in a year or so out from when he does it!  He seems to be always early or late on a trend or style!  TB2 + TB3 was just about right though.  I'm just rather tired of the boring (what he calls rap - if only he'd heard Eminem - that's rap/hip-hip) spoken verses and then a great chorus.  That is so boring... have I said how boring that is!?!  I mean it is different than any other artist out there (that I know of) but after Sunlight Shining and To Be Free... that gets a bit on the old side real fast!   TB2003 is a refreshing change from the original, which I tried to play yesterday, and I just couldn't, it sounds SOOO AWFUL!   I guess my problem, initially, is that I started with Mike Oldfield on TB2 and that is what I learned first (well I did buy TB73 at the same time - but couldn't stand to hear it)  I've been comparing this (TB2003) to TB2, and that just won't work.  TB2 is far more developed and stable then the original melodies, imho of course! I've tried to take it as its own entity and keep an open mind about it.  Just some things in it still bug me and come across TOOOOOO PROGRAMMED... errrrr!  I'm not sure why I was ok with TB2 being so programmed and this not being... maybe because I've come to dislike computers when it comes to Mike - he tends to rely on them and not his skill... especially with TRes Lunas (the album)  Tres Lunas - the game music or Tres Lunas II as we the fans call it, is far better and more developed.  Though I wouldn't give either of them a grammy!  I would however nominate this re-recording for a Grammy... it deserves it!!  TB2 should have got a grammy too!! And I'm rather surprised at all the positive press he has gotten over this re-recording!!!  Especially in the UK!!!  I had set myself up for hearing the usual negative - anti-Tubular Bell press coverage!  I guess this re-recording has been excepted since it is what most of the Tubular Bell loving community grew up with and knew well... rather than all the TB2 and TB3 overhall - jobs!?   Although, TB2003 is great and well done and absolutely exceptional in sections - I stand by my feeling that - by far - Tubular Bells II - is the best Bell album ever!   Just my opinion.  I couldn't stop playing it for six months to a year solid - my mum endured this album on repeat - thanks mum!   I'll probably shelve TB2003 in about another month - maybe not.  I can't wait to get my box-set though... I need new copies of TB2 and TB3!  Bought over the past ten years - 3 copies, not including the new box-set, of TB2 - and now this marks the 3rd copy of TB3 I've bought.  They keep wearing out you know!   Christopher PS Now how's about something completely different Mike... IT'S......................... (And the Liberty Bell theme plays) oh dear Christ it's another Bell song... AGGGGGGHHHHHHHH!!!!!! Just kidding... hahahahahahahaha (insert laughter and applause here - ok - GO! Back to top

TOBY Group: Members Posts: 1562 Joined: May 2002 Posted: June 05 2003, 19:11 All the positive press he's got for TB2003????????? There's not much press for TB2003 at all, positive or negative, not that I've seen, and I've scoured the magazines looking. I've seen two reviews for the album, one good, one very bad but it could be that because of it's release date being late in the month it's missed the current crop of magazines, maybe things will be different next month. There's been no newspaper articles at all that I'm aware of either which isn't a good sign, I think the truth is people are just bored of Mike releasing TB albums. I know everyone has indivdual tastes and their own personal take on Mike's music but I do alway's find it weird and slightly, from Mike's artistic point of view, distressing when I hear fans saying they think the original TB is 'awfull'. Whilst it doesn't suprise me in the least when you've got a career as diverse and eratic as Mike's that fans who have discovered his music through his recent albums don't like his signature one it alway's makes me feel slightly sad. TB is in a way the personification of him as a musician, the fact that some newer fans don't like it is for me a sign of how far removed and detracted his latter music has become. To give another analogy, I bet there's not many Pink Floyd fans of any age who don't like Dark Side of the Moon and argue endlessly about how dated and badly played it sounds. It has to be said I do actualy think Mike's own attitude to TB isn't very healthy as it seems to be one of complete non acceptance. For him TB2003 represents, for the time being at least, his perfect TB but for the rest of the world it will alway's be TB1973 that'll be seen as the definative and original version, certainly for generations of music lovers to come it will be. These recent interviews with him bring back memories of the comments he made when TB2 came out in 1992. Then as now he said the new version of TB had lots more power, direction, atmosphere, etc. And now as then my own personal thought was one of 'no you're utterly wrong', it's the original that has it all, its got everything, its a work of utterly sublime genius, and all the ingredients that make it such can't possibly be recreated in 1992 or 2003 or ever, why can't you, its creator, see it that way? Maybe we're all taking this thing way to seriously. I mean the flip side of the coin is that at least there's a TB album for everyone's tastes. If you prefer TB2 then stick with it and if you prefer the new version then stick with it but just remember where they all came from. ps Christopher. AOR = Adult Oriented Rock                     MOR = Male Oriented Rock Back to top

Holger Group: Members Posts: 1506 Joined: Feb. 2003 Posted: June 06 2003, 03:51 Quote (TOBY @ June 05 2003, 13:20) Far Above the Clouds (a rewrite after all) A rewrite of what, if I may ask? I've seen people write this a few times now. I know it has the Ommadawn drums but apart from that, I don't hear any significant similarities to other pieces. Back to top

TOBY Group: Members Posts: 1562 Joined: May 2002 Posted: June 06 2003, 04:28 It bears more than just a slight similarity to the end of Ommadawn part one other than just the drums. The general format of the piece is the same and the way the guitar solo works is pretty similar. This is by no means a major critisism, after all we know Mike quite often uses some musical sequences as blueprints for others. However in the context of the rest of TB3 not sounding particularly inventive, to put it mildly, it could easily be seen as a sign of a lack of fresh ideas.   On the other hand when you've released as many albums as Mike you could say it's inevitable that you retread ground you've walked on before. Back to top

Korgscrew Group: Super Admins Posts: 3511 Joined: Dec. 1999 Posted: June 06 2003, 13:15 Quote (TOBY @ June 06 2003, 00:11) I've seen two reviews for the album, one good, one very bad but it could be that because of it's release date being late in the month it's missed the current crop of magazines, maybe things will be different next month. It could be because some magazines write their reviews a month or so in advance and there were bugger all pre-release copies in the UK then. I did wonder how Warner planned on supplying all the UK's media with copies of the album when they only had 10 in the country and I think the answer is, as I suspected, that they just didn't bother trying... It's almost like they don't actually want anyone to hear it. Back to top

Holger Group: Members Posts: 1506 Joined: Feb. 2003 Posted: June 06 2003, 14:59 Quote (TOBY @ June 06 2003, 04:28) It bears more than just a slight similarity to the end of Ommadawn part one other than just the drums. The general format of the piece is the same and the way the guitar solo works is pretty similar. Yes, you're probably right there; the strange thing is, I never drew the connection to Ommadawn and didn't even realize the drums were from it until I read about it. And that's in spite of Ommadawn being my favourite MO. Or perhaps because of that   Back to top

Holger Group: Members Posts: 1506 Joined: Feb. 2003 Posted: June 06 2003, 15:03 Quote (Korgscrew @ June 06 2003, 13:15) It's almost like they don't actually want anyone to hear it. Maybe they're ashamed of it     Back to top

Brewer Group: Members Posts: 60 Joined: July 2002 Posted: June 07 2003, 05:39 I have just listened to TB2003 for the first time. After 2 listens i have just a couple of things to say. 1. I agree with most people about the opening Bass. I prefer the old version. The bass is too choppy. 2. I think J Clease dosent work. But then Viv Stanshell MOC was just perfection in itself. I suppose even if he was still alive he probably wouldnt have gotten the same feeling if he was to try the immortal utterances again, I think it was due to the fact that TB and MO was unknown the first time and the MOC was just another job and absolulty no pressure. Hence repeating it would be virtually impossible. 3. Side 2 was my favorite. The new version has some good points and bad ones. I think the playing is as usual, phenomonal. I always loved the "Peace" section especially the out of tune sounding piano riff. It was very hard to pick up in the original TB but is much more prominent in the new one. All in all a much better start to side 2. 4. Bagpipe Guitars. Wheres the Heart Stopping Kettle Drum from the first? This used to scare me shitless when listened in a dark room with headphones on. And still does but sadly its very muted in the new version. 5. Caveman/woman or to be PC caveperson (LOL) is great. Will i play it more than the original?    Well, yes because i dont play the original as much as i used to. Will I, in 30 years time, have listenen to it more than the original?    Very unlikly. I wore down 4 copies of the original on vinyl and a boxed set as well, the original Quad mix, when i went to replace it in the early 80's they only pressed a stereo mix. LMAO Am i glad he done it?    Yes. I never really liked the CD version of TB (Only the Boxed version) as there was a lot of breathing and mistakes in the first that really only surfaced with the introduction of the CD. Havnt listen to the 5.1 mix but will do. -------------- Maker of MOs favourite beverage No trees were harmed in the creation and sending of this message. However, a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced Back to top

Holger Group: Members Posts: 1506 Joined: Feb. 2003 Posted: June 07 2003, 06:20 Quote (Brewer @ June 07 2003, 05:39) 4. Bagpipe Guitars. Wheres the Heart Stopping Kettle Drum from the first? This used to scare me shitless when listened in a dark room with headphones on. And still does but sadly its very muted in the new version. Yes, I miss that, too! Back to top

Korgscrew Group: Super Admins Posts: 3511 Joined: Dec. 1999 Posted: June 09 2003, 08:59 Quote (Brewer @ June 07 2003, 10:39) 2. I think J Clease dosent work. But then Viv Stanshell MOC was just perfection in itself. I suppose even if he was still alive he probably wouldnt have gotten the same feeling if he was to try the immortal utterances again, I think it was due to the fact that TB and MO was unknown the first time and the MOC was just another job and absolulty no pressure. Hence repeating it would be virtually impossible. This is true, but I could have probably done a part myself that was more in keeping with the original feel than what John Cleese did. In fact, I'm pretty sure John Cleese could have done so too, with the right direction. There are also people who I think could have managed an amusing part without the 'trying to be funny' feel of John Cleese - Patrick Moore would have been one; his eccentric character is enough to make it amusing without it being silly or him having to act in an over the top way. What's there seems to be how Mike wanted it, though... Back to top

James Unregistered Posted: June 09 2003, 20:20 I believe Mike himself should have done the honours of the MC round he deserves that honour.I also second once again what Richard said Patrick Moore would have given it a sincerity and nobility beyond measure perhaps he could have played the timps too LOL!!!!. I think Mike  should have dropped the humour aspect for this 2003 one.Its sad that Mike feels a need to liten a beautiful and serious work so that it isn't labelled as boring in some shallow circles.I like John Cleese in Fawlty Toes but I can kind of do without his ear piercing rantings on this sacred ground!     Back to top

Brewer Group: Members Posts: 60 Joined: July 2002 Posted: June 10 2003, 19:59 That part of the problem. When i listen to TB2003 i cant help seeing Basil Fawlty and not John Cleese. With Viv Stanshall it was an anoymous face. I think someone like Anthony Hopkins would have been good. -------------- Maker of MOs favourite beverage No trees were harmed in the creation and sending of this message. However, a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced Back to top

TheManIsBack Group: Members Posts: 9 Joined: June 2003 Posted: June 12 2003, 14:31 FANTASTIC MIKE!!!!!!!!!!! Congratulations Mike to a truly amazing rerecording of TB! (Do you remember me by the way? I was 'TheMan' last year,  but I forgot the password... ) I was initially quite negative to another TB, and I didn't expect something so quite remarkable as it actually is! Very very good Mike! The best in almost 10 years, (nothing wíll ever live up the guitars in LetThereBeLight and Ascension). My first reaction: I am VERY VERY IMPRESSED by the HEAVY 'Basses', wow!!! Play it loud and enjoy!!! And 'Latin' is fantastic, far better than on the original. A lot of great guitars, very well played indeed. Genious. The guitarplaying on 'Ambient Guitars' is science fiction, Mike at his best! I like the dirty bass in the Introduction, it has the right mood, I do not agree the slightest in the criticism from some fans! (By the way TOBY, I very often agree with your opinions, you have many good remarks in general, but here I disagree). Mike has proven his Genious once again, now PLEASE GIVE US NEW INSTRUMENTAL MATERIAL, NO VOCALS, JUST 40 MINUTES FLOWING COMPLEX LOADED POLYPHONIC MASTERPIECES IN THE STYLE OF TB, AMAROK, INCANTATIONS. We know you can do it! Another thing: have you fans listen to the great guitar playing at the Paris live concert from 99 (available on the web)? I love the way Mike plays LetThereBeLight and JewelInTheCrown. The guitar sings! Amazing Mike! Back to top

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