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smcpoland Group: Members Posts: 4 Joined: May 2003 Posted: May 31 2003, 05:23 Well I picked up my copy only yesterday (the "limited Edition" Complete TB) and I have to say I am overall quite pleased. HOWEVER to major issues will make me return the product for full refund ---- what I believe to be the copy protection system - is AUDIBLE. or it is "vynil dirty fingers" track 1 - 4:40 - 5:30 There is a very disticintive clicking in the background during the master of ceremonies - once you hear it it never goes away. From 00:57 onwards. And the the Master of Ceremonies can clearly be heard in the background stating mandolin again after the original saying track 11 5:16.  Tape seep is what it used to be called in the days of old. and that's the first side - I cannot listem to any more of what is supposed to be a grade 1 recording - it sucks. If you want to play this on an ordinary system then sure keep it - you may never hear these problems. My system is Mark Levinson(http://www.marklevinson.com/), it is designed to truely play music - and it can pick up the problems of a bad recording or other (copy of instance) technologies. Interested to hear other peoples views and comments regards Sean Back to top

Ugo Group: Members Posts: 5495 Joined: April 2000 Posted: May 31 2003, 09:31 Quote (smcpoland @ May 31 2003, 11:23) [...] what I believe to be the copy protection system - is AUDIBLE. or it is "vynil dirty fingers" track 1 - 4:40 - 5:30 There is a very disticintive clicking in the background during the master of ceremonies - once you hear it it never goes away. From 00:57 onwards. And the the Master of Ceremonies can clearly be heard in the background stating mandolin again after the original saying track 11 5:16.   To take your points in the order you state them: 1: The clicks on track 1 are due to Mike plucking the nylon strings of his acoustic guitar with his nails, as he usually does, combined with the synthy little bells in the background. These clicks were already in TB 1973, nothing to worry about. 2: Same as 1, Mike's nails on electric guitar strings and/or bass strings. 3: IMHO Cleese saying Mandolin twice is intentional, and meant to be funny. In short: I can perfectly understand your desire to return your copy of TB 2003 because of the nasty tricks that the copy protection system is playing, but I don't think that its effects are 'audible', at least not in the points you mention. -------------- Ugo C. - a devoted Amarokian Back to top

MO fan Group: Members Posts: 177 Joined: Nov. 2002 Posted: May 31 2003, 14:42 I am also taking my CD back as quite a few people including myself have had their CD stop on a specific track. All down to copy protection? Previous post repeated here.... Has anyone noticed their TB2003 CD stopping dead on track seven with a personnel portable CD player. I have tried it three times and it stopped on the same track for no apparent reason, yet it works on my Hi-fi ok, weird !!!! Wonder if it has to do with that new copy protection stuff. I think I will ask for a new CD. P.S.    I checked out my portable player with other CD's and its working fine, make:- Goodmans. Back to top

Q! Group: Members Posts: 110 Joined: Dec. 2002 Posted: May 31 2003, 16:39 Quote IMHO Cleese saying Mandolin twice is intentional, and meant to be funny. I bet my balls that the second mandolin is not intended, it's sound rather out of place. It's a bug not a feature. Quote I have tried it three times and it stopped on the same track for no apparent reason, yet it works on my Hi-fi ok, weird ! Same here, dvd player will read only first six tracks, cd-burner reads the whole cd fine. -------------- http://qisgod.host.sk/ Back to top

smcpoland Group: Members Posts: 4 Joined: May 2003 Posted: June 01 2003, 11:09 well thanks to you all for your inputs - I have had separate emails as well about the "quality" of the recording - and there certainly seem to be more than one or two flaws - as to Ugo's finger scratching idea - nope I play guitar - it does not work for me that one, The first set - believe me there really is a background "noise" you get none of this on any other recordings (even the HDCD ones I have (and can play back)) The second set - nail clicking are just too perfect to be real - they cannot be - especially if you listen to the frequency and tempo of the clicks as for Mandolin twice - if it is a joke it is a very bad one - and totally ruins the sequence - Back to top

bugular tell Group: Members Posts: 482 Joined: Mar. 2003 Posted: June 01 2003, 15:07 is it really worth stripping this album down to little flaws? the original was full of them thats why mike re-recorded it, but that doesn't stop people from loving the music, it is a wonderful peice, and should be enjoyed for what it is, not for what you can find a problem with, i understand that if the cd stops at certain tracks then by all means take it back, but please realise that mike is not a perfect person, no one is, so little flaws are always going to appear, like i said just enjoy it for what it is, a fantastic piece of music, and to make things worse mike didnt even make the top 40 in the album charts here in the uk!   -------------- Light travels faster than sound, thats why some people appear bright until you hear them speak Back to top

TOBY Group: Members Posts: 1562 Joined: May 2002 Posted: June 01 2003, 16:56 Are you suprised??????? I've been shocked at how little promotion of this album there's been in the UK, has anybody seen a single article about it yet? But then again its possibly a sign of how utterly bored people are with Mike releasing TB albums. Back on topic. There's perfection and then there's perfection. The little flaws you talk about arn't Mike's mistakes, they're WEA's. Mike worked long and hard to get this recording of the highest quality, thats the ONLY reason he did this project. If the transfer to CD, which is out of Mike's hands, is not of the highest comparable quality then whats the point of Mike's effort? This whole thing's way beyond a joke now, it would be very interesting indeed to hear what he thinks of it all. Back to top

Sir Mustapha Group: Musicians Posts: 2802 Joined: April 2003 Posted: June 02 2003, 08:12 Quote (bugular tell @ June 01 2003, 15:07) is it really worth stripping this album down to little flaws? the original was full of them thats why mike re-recorded it, but that doesn't stop people from loving the music, it is a wonderful peice, and should be enjoyed for what it is, not for what you can find a problem with, i understand that if the cd stops at certain tracks then by all means take it back, but please realise that mike is not a perfect person, no one is, so little flaws are always going to appear, like i said just enjoy it for what it is, a fantastic piece of music, and to make things worse mike didnt even make the top 40 in the album charts here in the uk!   It is one things to hear little notes out of tune and tempo or little imperfections in an album recorded 30 years ago, and one thing is to listen to a CD supposed to be of top-notch quality and still hear noise on it, because it completely screws up the musical experience. I myself would be extremelly angry if I got to buy the CD and hear all those imperfections! But I'm in 100% agreement with Toby when he says this is not Mike's fault, and the recording company is the only one to blame. And I think that making such a poor job on Mike's hard work is one big, big disrespect to him and us, fans. This is just horrible. -------------- Check out http://ferniecanto.com.br for all my music, including my latest albums: Don't Stay in the City, Making Amends and Builders of Worlds. Also check my Bandcamp page: http://ferniecanto.bandcamp.com Back to top

Man In The Rain Group: Members Posts: 405 Joined: April 2002 Posted: June 02 2003, 08:34 Eeeeek, I haven't had a chance to listen to it yet because my mother bought me it as a present and I haven't been home yet...I'm really worried, it sounds like this release has been really, really botched up   -------------- Hergest Ridge 165 - Ommadawn 038 - Incantations 243 Back to top

MusicallyInspired Group: Musicians Posts: 1445 Joined: June 2001 Posted: June 02 2003, 08:48 The album is amazing don't listen to them. Don't worry. But I do agree with this. Quote But I'm in 100% agreement with Toby when he says this is not Mike's fault, and the recording company is the only one to blame. And I think that making such a poor job on Mike's hard work is one big, big disrespect to him and us, fans. This is just horrible. It still passes, though. -------------- BrandonBlume.com "The beauty in life is in the embracing of the variety of things. If all the world was blue there would be no colour blue." Back to top

timshen Group: Members Posts: 684 Joined: Mar. 2001 Posted: June 02 2003, 09:17 It really is not as bad as it sounds. I'm in total agreement that Copy Protection is a bad thing and has caused SOME problems. If my CD didn't work on my CD player I would take it back. However, i've really had no problems whatsoever in playing it (even managed to rip some MP3s of the whole album for my own MP3 portable player). It would be inetersting to ee exactly what percentage of those buying the CD are having problems playing it - I guess it would be fairly small (however not insignificant). On the warning label it does say that it is 'playable on most CD players' meaning that it will not play on some (marketing suicide from the very start). Copy protection will not last long IMHO. Tim -------------- Expect Great Things. Attempt Great Things. Back to top

bugular tell Group: Members Posts: 482 Joined: Mar. 2003 Posted: June 03 2003, 07:50 At least mike is in the top 40 selling albums of the week so far number 23 in this chart album chart -------------- Light travels faster than sound, thats why some people appear bright until you hear them speak Back to top

Sir Mustapha Group: Musicians Posts: 2802 Joined: April 2003 Posted: June 03 2003, 08:33 I'm seriously considering buying it when I get the money, and if I find it anywhere here. -------------- Check out http://ferniecanto.com.br for all my music, including my latest albums: Don't Stay in the City, Making Amends and Builders of Worlds. Also check my Bandcamp page: http://ferniecanto.bandcamp.com Back to top

TOBY Group: Members Posts: 1562 Joined: May 2002 Posted: June 03 2003, 08:49 Musically Inspired how can you possibly say "don't listen to them, don't worry". We're not all making this up you know. TB2003 does not sound amazing for me it simply doesn't sound at all. I'm one of the many it would seem who simply can't play this CD, thats the bottom line as far as I'm concerned. I don't know about you but that is something to worry about, fair enough if you can play it and enjoy it but others can't. Putting the actual music aside I don't think this relaese passes at all and in reply to Man in the Rain, I'm affraid you're right, it is a botch up. Back to top

Korgscrew Group: Super Admins Posts: 3511 Joined: Dec. 1999 Posted: June 03 2003, 10:40 A thing to consider, for those people thinking "It plays ok for me, why should I worry about copy protection?": I've been investigating the way this system (Macrovision CDS-200) actually works. As I feared, amongst its methods are introducing high numbers of errors into the audio. That of course means that the error correction on your CD player is working much harder than it would be on a normal CD. Error correction, as you may know already, is put there so that the CD still plays when there are scratches and other imperfections present on the surface of the CD. However, if it's already being pushed to the limit correcting errors introduced by the copy protection system, it's not unlikely that even the tiniest scratch will cause audible problems, and more serious wear on the CD (which the player would usually be fine with) will cause the player to give up completely. Warner don't care, of course - they'll be getting more money when you buy a replacement. I have nothing against the music itself, and indeed would encourage people to listen to what Mike's done with it. I would not however, encourage people to put up with any kind of problem with the product - I actually feel that it's very disrespectful both to Mike and to the paying customer for the record company to be deliberately introducing these kinds of faults into their CDs. Back to top

MO fan Group: Members Posts: 177 Joined: Nov. 2002 Posted: June 03 2003, 13:47 I took my CD back to Virgin megastore where I bought it and the lad gave me a refund no problem, he added that a lot of TB2003 CD albums had been returned due to the copy protection causing problems with playing. I for one will NOT be getting another copy of TB2003 expecially with this error producing copy protection. Cheers MO fan   Back to top

Sir Mustapha Group: Musicians Posts: 2802 Joined: April 2003 Posted: June 03 2003, 14:02 It is outrageous that the companies are making poor quality CDs to implement a security system that doesn't work. It makes me angry that the talent of great musicians is being disrespected by incompetent businessmen. -------------- Check out http://ferniecanto.com.br for all my music, including my latest albums: Don't Stay in the City, Making Amends and Builders of Worlds. Also check my Bandcamp page: http://ferniecanto.bandcamp.com Back to top

TOBY Group: Members Posts: 1562 Joined: May 2002 Posted: June 03 2003, 14:08 I'm glad lots of people are returning them. Hopefully this should get the message through to the record companies not to put such a stupid thing as copy protection on again, but I have my doubts. Back to top

Fallen Angel Group: Members Posts: 28 Joined: June 2003 Posted: June 05 2003, 08:16 copy protection sucks but why return some of the most beautiful music ever made, after all it is Mike we're talking about here. Quote To hell with me cos' i'm a fallen angel -------------- Heaven was Open and I fell out Back to top

MO fan Group: Members Posts: 177 Joined: Nov. 2002 Posted: June 05 2003, 12:27 Quote (Fallen Angel @ June 05 2003, 08:16) copy protection sucks but why return some of the most beautiful music ever made, after all it is Mike we're talking about here. I don't give a toss who the artist is, even Mike ! If a music disc is at fault due to the introduction of a copy protection system that prevents you listening to the whole album without it stopping every five minutes, then I do not want it. I noticed at my local Virgin Megastore, all TB2003 CD's have now been withdrawn, due to the amount of complaints and CD's being returned. Cheers, MO fan   Back to top

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