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Question: Favourite Voyager Track :: Total Votes:80
Poll choices Votes Statistics
The Song of the Sun 12  [15.00%]
Celtic Rain 3  [3.75%]
The Hero 1  [1.25%]
Women of Ireland 6  [7.50%]
The Voyager 2  [2.50%]
She Moves Through the Fair 1  [1.25%]
Dark Island 8  [10.00%]
Wild Goose Flaps its Wings 12  [15.00%]
Flowers of the Forest 5  [6.25%]
Mont St Michel 30  [37.50%]
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Topic: Favourite Voyager Track, Favourite Voyager Track< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
Bill Bobaggins Offline




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Posted: Aug. 26 2005, 18:41

I just can't get into this album.  I've tried.  The only song that I actually like is the title track.  Wish I could say something nicer, but then I wouldn't be honest.

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The Bell(end) Offline




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Posted: Aug. 27 2005, 07:54

Quote (Bill Bobaggins @ Aug. 26 2005, 23:41)
I just can't get into this album.  I've tried.  The only song that I actually like is the title track.  Wish I could say something nicer, but then I wouldn't be honest.

IMO the title track is one of the worst!

Song of the sun, Celtic rain, Women of Ireland, She moves through the fair, Dark island, Flowers of the forest and Mont St. Michel are all great tracks, this album is better used as background music however.


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Alan D Offline




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Posted: Aug. 27 2005, 09:03

Quote (Bill Bobaggins @ Aug. 26 2005, 23:41)
I just can't get into this album.  I've tried.  The only song that I actually like is the title track.  Wish I could say something nicer, but then I wouldn't be honest.

I'm sure I've said this somewhere else, so my apologies for repeating myself. But I feel much the same as you do about most of the album (apart from Wild Goose and Mt St Michel). However, when I popped it into the player while driving through the Scottish Highlands I found that every track was transformed. Maybe it would work in mountain scenery in the US also?
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Piltdownboy on horseback 22 Offline




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Posted: Sep. 28 2005, 15:39

Hope he'll do something like this after Light and Shade. No electronics anyway (although it did work on Distant Earth, my favourite in fact). Mont stMichel gave me shivers last time I heard it. So did wild goose... :D  Just magic. I hear that Romance is on in the background now... have to move to change that to Surfing!!  ;)  Byebye!! :cool:

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amazarak Offline




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Posted: Sep. 28 2005, 16:31

In my case I was struggling between MSM and tSoTS...
MSM won, as I heard Luar na Lubre's tSoTS and I like it far more than Mike's version.

amazarak


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arron11196 Offline




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Posted: Oct. 28 2005, 17:33

The whole album is not something I play very often, but when I'm in the mood for it I really enjoy it. Favourite is of course MSM - i never really considered it pastiche or over the top (once again, Alan, remember FATC?) but in fact find it infinately rewarding (and also, a brilliant prelude to TBIII which is next in my playlist - although I rarely listen to Oldfield back to back)

My other favourite is FOTF - which just makes me wanna sing along (and sometimes I do). The other tracks are really enjoyable (apart from WGFIW, I can stand listening to it but I can't say it uplifts me) and listening will often leave me happy yet ready for even more Oldfield (perhaps something even more polished, Like TSODE, TBII or TBIII.)


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Arron J Eagling

Everyone's interpretation is different, and everyone has a right to that opinion. There is no "right" one, I am adding this post to communicate my thoughts to share them with like-minded souls who will be able to comment in good nature.

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Alan D Offline




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Posted: Oct. 29 2005, 05:07

Quote (arron11196 @ Oct. 28 2005, 22:33)
Favourite is of course MSM - i never really considered it pastiche or over the top (once again, Alan, remember FATC?) but in fact find it infinately rewarding

I certainly do. It's a curious thing, this 'over-the-topness', and your comment got me thinking again about it Arron.

Of all Vaughan Williams's symphonies,Sinfonia Antarctica always comes as a bit of a shock. VW is so sure-footed and understated - but the Antarctic Symphony always seems different. The music hints at melodrama rather than drama; it's very moving, and yet afterwards the experience never seems quite as satisfying as listening to the other, more understated symphonies. The interesting thing is that it was developed from VW's film score for 'Scott of the Antarctic'.

It's the same sense that I get from Mt St Michel. Don't get me wrong - I love the piece. Couldn't be without it. But it has the same kind of Hollywood flavour about it as VW's Sinfonia Antarctica - as if it were written, not to stand alone, but as a film soundtrack, and trying just slightly too hard to wring my emotions from me.

Perfection in art is a nonsense, isn't it? The artist walks such a narrow line - slip one way and the art is sterile; slip the other and it becomes ostentatious. And the whole thing is made even more difficult because we as art-receivers have different tolerance levels, so one person's take on a given piece will never be quite the same as another's.

Ah! I've just remembered that another reason Mt St Michel has a whiff of Hollywood about it for me, is that parts of it remind me of Malcom Arnold - another film-scorey kind of composer ('Bridge on the River Kwai'; 'Inn of the Sixth Happiness' ).

Yes.... Malcolm Arnold's English Dances; Vaughan Williams's Wasps Overture; Mike Oldfield's Mt St Michel. They all have a similar kind of cinemascope feeling to them: larger than life. 'Come!' they invite. 'Enjoy the spectacle!' And why not? I may have a back-to-back orgy of MA, VW and MO later today and see how it works out!!
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arron11196 Offline




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Posted: Oct. 29 2005, 07:48

Absolutely. I just love they way when I get lost in the piece and do my 'image storytelling' thing, that I can see the mist, the mountain, the delicate flowers covered in dew as I walk to the summit, the animals hiding from me in the woods, the sunlight lost in the haze above me, but wreaked in the most glorious colours I have ever imagined. And then you round the corner and come to the castle... :)

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Arron J Eagling

Everyone's interpretation is different, and everyone has a right to that opinion. There is no "right" one, I am adding this post to communicate my thoughts to share them with like-minded souls who will be able to comment in good nature.

(insert the last 5 mins of Crises here)
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Alan D Offline




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Posted: Oct. 29 2005, 09:50

Quote (arron11196 @ Oct. 29 2005, 12:48)
I can see the mist, the mountain, the delicate flowers covered in dew as I walk to the summit, the animals hiding from me in the woods, the sunlight lost in the haze above me, but wreaked in the most glorious colours I have ever imagined. And then you round the corner and come to the castle... :)

Perfect in cinemascope!!

I tried my orgy, as follows:

1. Malcom Arnold's suites of English Dances (8); Scottish Dances (4 - wow, listen to no, 3, fans of Mt St Michel); and Cornish Dances (4).
2. Mike Oldfield: Wild Goose Flaps its Wings, followed by Mt St Michel.
3. Vaughan Williams's Wasps Overture.

I expected the VW to bring all to a satisfying conclusion, but actually it was a bit of a let-down after Mike's extravaganza. If this had been a 3-way boxing match, I'd have said that Mike hit the winning knock-out blow before the third contestant even entered the ring.
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arron11196 Offline




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Posted: Oct. 29 2005, 16:09

A boxing match as to whom is the most commercial?

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Arron J Eagling

Everyone's interpretation is different, and everyone has a right to that opinion. There is no "right" one, I am adding this post to communicate my thoughts to share them with like-minded souls who will be able to comment in good nature.

(insert the last 5 mins of Crises here)
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Sir Mustapha Offline




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Posted: Oct. 29 2005, 18:58

Quote (Alan D @ Oct. 29 2005, 05:07)
Perfection in art is a nonsense, isn't it? The artist walks such a narrow line - slip one way and the art is sterile; slip the other and it becomes ostentatious. And the whole thing is made even more difficult because we as art-receivers have different tolerance levels, so one person's take on a given piece will never be quite the same as another's.

Wanna hear something interesting (and non-offensive, for once)? There's something in my mind telling me that making art isn't a matter of difficulty (not counting the technical aspect, mind! ). It's only difficult when you don't have content - in that case, you have to balance several aspects and elements that don't have much to do with things to say, kind of like building a tower without a foundation - or better: doing a history test when you haven't studied. You base yourself in logics and common sense, but you give a chance to the unexpected, too. Take too hard in either of those approaches and you're bound to fall in the test's traps. Not when you have the knowledge, though.

My mind keeps making analogies to a speech, too: when you don't have anything worthwhile to say, you have to rely on charisma, captivating words, expression. intonation and several other aspects of presentation in order to sound good. It's all very hard, when you don't have anything to say. Some do manage to do it right, but when the message is good, even obvious flaws can be forgiven, with a bit of effort. After all, having a solid idea, having a message to deliver gives you enthusiasm and self-confidence, and you're not bothered in worrying with such futile details. And if you're talented, chances are that you'll get them right, after all.


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Alan D Offline




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Posted: Oct. 30 2005, 05:39

Quote (arron11196 @ Oct. 29 2005, 21:09)
A boxing match as to whom is the most commercial?

No, Arron. The match was to find out who raised the most goosebumps.
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Alan D Offline




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Posted: Oct. 30 2005, 05:53

Quote (Sir Mustapha @ Oct. 29 2005, 23:58)
Wanna hear something interesting

Yes, always!  ;)

But I'm not sure I follow what you're saying Sir M. I think you're suggesting that making art is only difficult for the artist who has nothing to say but nevertheless is trying to make art. Is that right? If so, then I'd suggest that the artist who has nothing to say but is trying to make art probably isn't actually making art at all. But I don't think that implies that making art is easy for the genuine artist. Turner used to say that critics never understood how difficult painting is.

My original point, though, was not really about the difficulty of making art, but the difficulty of eliciting the appropriate response. MO pours his heart and soul into making Mt St Michel, let's say: but there are so many things that can intervene between any putative listener and the music that the outcome - in terms of artistic communication between MO and his listener - is always unpredictable.
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arron11196 Offline




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Posted: Oct. 30 2005, 05:56

Quote (Alan D @ Oct. 30 2005, 05:39)
Quote (arron11196 @ Oct. 29 2005, 21:09)
A boxing match as to whom is the most commercial?

No, Arron. The match was to find out who raised the most goosebumps.

:) Good stuff.

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Arron J Eagling

Everyone's interpretation is different, and everyone has a right to that opinion. There is no "right" one, I am adding this post to communicate my thoughts to share them with like-minded souls who will be able to comment in good nature.

(insert the last 5 mins of Crises here)
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Sir Mustapha Offline




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Posted: Oct. 30 2005, 11:18

Quote
My original point, though, was not really about the difficulty of making art, but the difficulty of eliciting the appropriate response. MO pours his heart and soul into making Mt St Michel, let's say: but there are so many things that can intervene between any putative listener and the music that the outcome - in terms of artistic communication between MO and his listener - is always unpredictable.


That unpredictability is what makes art interesting, though, isn't it? To me, art has a lot to do with interpretation, context, multiplicity. If an artist is making his art with the intent of causing one specific response, then he's kind of spending effort in vain, isn't he? To my knowledge and my experience, you don't make art to provoke a response; you do make art to provoke responses. It's a subtle difference, but it's a difference nonetheless. If you fine-tune your music to one audience, it's not gonna work to the other one, anyway. If you fine-tune your music to your intentions, then it's more likely that the public will catch that. And as a critic, and also as a wannabe-musician, my opinion is that an artist should work on what he thinks is best, not accuse the critics of this and that.

As a final note, I generally don't like it when a piece of music, for example, is produced to induce awe with its difficulty - like listening to that one-hundred-notes-per-second guitar solo and thinking "man, it must be difficult to play like that". It's different from listening to Amarok and thinking, "man, he must have worked really hard to finish that", or also, listening to that synth-like guitar solo in Talking Heads' "Born Under Punches" and thinking, "man, that's awesome!" Yeah, it's just a point of view.


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Alan D Offline




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Posted: Oct. 30 2005, 13:46

Quote (Sir Mustapha @ Oct. 30 2005, 16:18)
If an artist is making his art with the intent of causing one specific response, then he's kind of spending effort in vain, isn't he?

Well, I was originally talking more about listener response than artist intention. Once he's made it, all the artist can do is present his work - in this case, Mt St Michel. Some listeners will have goosebumps and think it's wonderful; some will find it too Hollywood and dismiss it. Some of us (eg me) will dither about in the middle, getting the goosebumps on some occasions, but at other times thinking it's a bit too blatantly sentimental. That's what I meant about the difficulty of pinning down the true merits of the thing.
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Alan D Offline




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Posted: Oct. 30 2005, 13:52

Quote (Sir Mustapha @ Oct. 30 2005, 16:18)
As a final note, I generally don't like it when a piece of music, for example, is produced to induce awe with its difficulty

No, I don't have any time for that either. You might as well watch a tightrope walker or a lion tamer.

That isn't what Turner meant, of course, about being aware of the difficulty.
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Sir Mustapha Offline




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Posted: Oct. 30 2005, 17:39

Oh, yes. The artist has to beat the challenges of dealing with the public and their wishes and wants. Funny how, in so many different professions, dealing with the people is the worst part, isn't it? :) It's a very delicate balance, though. An artist must hear the public's opinions, absorb criticism, but also remain true to himself, and stop trying to please everyone - i.e. doing the impossible. It's not easy, definitely not. In this aspect, what you said is true.

Quote
That isn't what Turner meant, of course, about being aware of the difficulty.


Yeah, it's true. There are many kinds of critics and criticism. In Brazil, once, there was a young painter who started introducing the European avant-garde trends into the country. It was highly successful on her two first exhibitions. But one very influential writer and art critic, Monteiro Lobato, and his lambasting review published on a newspaper, pretty much ruined the artist's carreer. It might not be a case of a critic not understanding the difficulty of it (it was actually his conservative views on art), but it's a clear case of how art could be a very cruel business in that time. Fortunately, nowadays, there seems not to be anymore one voice that defines what's right and what's wrong, especially in music. Say, just like we have MTV, we have Pitchforkmedia - both terrible, but with opposide views. The public is never predictable, though.


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Alan D Offline




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Posted: Oct. 31 2005, 05:26

Quote (Sir Mustapha @ Oct. 30 2005, 22:39)
It might not be a case of a critic not understanding the difficulty of it (it was actually his conservative views on art}

No, I agree - I think you're exactly right to identify it in these terms. The critic's conventional blinkers would prevent him from seeing the difficulties that the artist overcame. (Of course the work might actually be rubbish - but the point is that he wasn't in a position to tell whether it was rubbish or not).

In the case of Mt St Michel I sometimes wonder if Mike himself might have struggled a bit with the over-the-top romanticism of it all; and then actually decided to go with it - a kind of 'No, dammit - I want sweeping, lush, romantic strings, and I'm going to have them, no matter what anyone says!'

I'm glad he did.
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EeToN Offline




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Posted: Oct. 31 2005, 13:14

Quote (Alan D @ Oct. 31 2005, 11:26)
In the case of Mt St Michel I sometimes wonder if Mike himself might have struggled a bit with the over-the-top romanticism of it all...

It's actually not Mike who's listed on the booklet as the arranger of Mont St. Michel but Robin Smith. I don't know though whose decision was it all.


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