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Topic: drums on tb 2003, who's playing< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
BOOsTER Offline




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Posted: May 29 2003, 10:44

dunno :) I don't care...

and they should judge after they hear me play :P


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Korgscrew Offline




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Posted: May 29 2003, 14:18

It depends if you want something to 'replace' a drummer, or something to produce good electronic rhythms.
If you want realistic drums, the Zoom Rhythmtrax machines actually seem quite good.
Alesis have a good reputation for their drum machines - you could have a look at one of those.

For electronic sounds, the Electribe-R seems great. The new Electribe MX looks fun too.

I have used computers on stage, and can see both the advantages and disadvantages of it. With the kinds of MIDI controllers that are available now, the computer becomes a bit more useful, as all the paramaters are there under your fingers, where before you might have needed to have clicked on all sorts of things, which isn't really so good on stage when you need something immediate.
The problem I see with using one running software synthesisers instead of a bank of hardware synths, is that if the computer goes down, the lot go down, whereas if one hardware synth stops working, all the rest are still usable (though of course not if the power goes on one and all the rest are connected via MIDI Thru - that then demands a bit of speed rewiring :laugh:) and you can still play music even if it doesn't sound quite as it should.

I think that the 'human aspect' involved in programming a rhythm is something very different from that of playing an instrument. It's a much more technical, calculating way of thinking. It is of course possible to program 'feel' into a computer, but we do have to ask, as Man In The Rain did: why? Sometimes there is a reason, but sometimes I think it has to be questioned why things are being done - it usually takes me a lot less time to play a part in off an instrument than it does to program the equivalent.
What I really meant about losing the human aspect, is that it's a shame when we lose sight of why music is being made, that instead of recording a rock song because a few musicians want to get together and have fun making great music, it's all done by someone who's essentially a programmer, because there's money or fame to be made in it.
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Holger Offline




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Posted: May 29 2003, 15:42

For some reason, I really like drum computers, and that goes totally contrary to what I usually think about imitating instruments with synthesizers / samplers and about sequencing. But it gives me great delight if I manage to program a really good rhythm. And I also have to say I like how Mike programmed the drums on TB2003. But of course that is not to say I dislike the real thing. Simon Philips drummed marvellously on Mike's 80s stuff.
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Blue Dolphin Offline




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Posted: May 30 2003, 12:54

Thanks for the tip Korgie!

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Guru Meditation Offline




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Posted: May 30 2003, 14:28

Imitating live drummer is plain stupidity. Every instrument has it's own ways, and acoustic drum is one thing while the drum machine is another. I was never a fan of neither of them, I don't care if it's live or not, rythm is rythm. Human feel is not in details, but in the main idea. You can achieve it through synth or through guitar or acoustic drum, whatever. There are various ways of communication.

I heaven't heared TB2003 still, but reading through posts I realise that Mike concieved it more as a progressive then traditional record, so it is very appropriate to use drum machines and not the real drummer.

Greetings
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Ugo Offline




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Posted: May 30 2003, 18:03

Sorry for the little off-topic, but, since we're talking about drum machines, I'd like to ask a question to Richard: is it hard to program a drum computer to make it play an irregular rhythm, as they did on the single mix of Introduction?

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Korgscrew Offline




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Posted: May 31 2003, 11:28

Not if it's capable of playing in that time signature.
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Ugo Offline




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Posted: May 31 2003, 18:23

Quote (Korgscrew @ May 31 2003, 17:28)
Not if it's capable of playing in that time signature.

AFAUIK the time sig of the main TB theme changes every bar... one is 5/4 (minus one octave), another is 4/4... and so on until the main guitar comes in and it becomes a steady 4/4 [which doesn't happen in the single]. Do you know if there is a computer which is capable of playing shifting time sigs?

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BOOsTER Offline




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Posted: June 01 2003, 07:45

I think that software drum computer like ReDrum in reason is capable to :)

you can automate midi to change signature each bar...

on hardware I think it would be possible some way too ;)


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Korgscrew Offline




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Posted: June 02 2003, 14:38

Yes, most modern drum machines can change time signatures quite easily. Dance orientated groove boxes might not be so willing, but more sophisticated ones will have no problem.

As far as I remember, it's 7/8 and 9/8.
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Korgscrew Offline




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Posted: July 21 2003, 02:39

Something I didn't get round to saying earlier - from the website of Plan 1 Studios:

Quote
09/12/2002
Enlisted from England: As part of the re-recording work for MIKE OLDFIELD's legendary album "Tubular Bells", set for release in 2003, the drum track on "Caveman" was newly laid down at PLAN 1.
Thanks to the painstaking efforts expended in setting up the microphoning and designing the spatial accoustics, drummer THOMAS SIMMERL was able to perfectly reproduce the original track beat for beat - right down to the one that was even originally missed the first time around!
Producer: Ralf Weigand;
at the console: Thomas Sußmair and Philip Lewis

Any comments?
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Ugo Offline




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Posted: July 21 2003, 17:41

Quote (Korgscrew @ July 21 2003, 08:39)
Quote
Thanks to the painstaking efforts expended in setting up the microphoning and designing the spatial accoustics, drummer THOMAS SIMMERL was able to perfectly reproduce the original track beat for beat [...]


Any comments?

Well, I have a comment. :) If the drums were really played by Mr. Simmerl, why isn't he credited on the (altogether very careful) CD sleeve? Did Mike forget him?  ;)  :zzz:


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Ram
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Posted: July 21 2003, 18:11

Well, Mike use to re-write some tracks 5 or 6 times before releasingh them. So I think Thomas Simmerl from Plan 1 played live drums for caveman but finally Mike has programmed the drums himself. The percussion programming from Tres Lunas is also done by two guys from Plan 1 Studios in Munich, Germany.
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Der Straussmeister
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Posted: July 22 2003, 19:50

Well now.

To be honest, hearing the Tubes 2003, and having seen a picture of the man's studio, I personally thought it was Mike himself kicking the trash out of that electric Roland drumset thingamajig in the corner. Reason being, it does sound live, and as a drummer, I should know. But with technology these days, who the devil knows? And if not, it's certainly the best piece of *ahem* programming I have heard in some time; beats the Lunas loops six ways to the peddler, I can tell you. So who cares what it was as long as it sounds good and it wasn't ^#*(@ turntables........

Cheers all. :)
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LivingForever Offline




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Posted: Oct. 13 2003, 07:41

Wow... and the one thing I thought was hugely improved on this new version was the pounding drum track on the 'Caveman' section.

I was going to praise Mike for getting a decent drummer in... oh well!

James


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