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Topic: A Great Introduction For New Listeners< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
Sweetpea Offline




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Posted: Aug. 23 2007, 15:48

I recall reading 'first contact' suggestions, in another forum, for which work to expose listeners to first. Listening again to TBII, it occurred to me that this is one of Mike's most accessible albums. It has an immediate and long lasting appeal. The opening piece, "Sentinel", is stunning and I know one person who bought the album just for "The Bell" because it "sounds Christmas-y". Even its moments of weirdness ("Altered State", "Moonshine"*) are gently good-humored rather than alarming. There's an overall 'I won't hurt you' vibe which is different from say... Amarok. Plus, it has a contender for the title of 'most beautiful twelve minutes in all MO-dom': "Weightless/Great Plain/Sunset Door". One would expect there to be some 'filler' but, IMO, practically every moment on TBII has artistic interest. One might hesitate to begin with a sequel of sorts, but I'd had minimal familiarity with the original TB when I was first exposed to TBII, and I was immediately hooked.


* I've mentioned elsewhere that I often skip "Moonshine", but when I recently listened to it as an isolated track, I realized that it's a fun, infectious piece. Still not sure I actually like it on TBII, though.

(Yes, I footnoted my post, and I am chagrined.)


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"I'm no physicist, but technically couldn't Mike both be with the horse and be flying through space at the same time? (On account of the earth's orbit around the Sun and all that). So it seems he never had to make the choice after all. I bet he's kicking himself now." - clotty
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Ebony Offline




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Posted: Aug. 23 2007, 17:18

I'd definitely agree with that.
It was my friend's incessant playing of this album and my liking of it that led me to rediscover (and listen to in it's entirety for the first time) the original Tubular Bells and begin my descent (or should it be ascent  :) ) into MO fandom.
And no matter how many of his albums I get (I'm now at 10 and counting...), TBII always remains one of my favourites.
The Great Plain is indeed a beautiful piece of music, though it has an uncanny habit of making me cry.
Altered State is definitely friendlier than it's TB Piltdown Man equivalent - which actually scared me the first time I heard it!  :/
I like Moonshine.  I think it's just another example of Mike ending a serious, emotion-filled album on a lighter note, like he did with the Sailors Hornpipe on the end of TB and On Horseback on Ommadawn.
:cool:
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ImAFoolAndImLaughing Offline




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Posted: Aug. 23 2007, 17:53

I'm not sure I like Sailors' Hornpipe or Moonshine - at least not in the context of the Tubular albums. On TB1, it's always seemed to be too out of place - a filler track, and whereas On Horseback was probably included on the Ommadawn LP for the same reason (i.e. to take up space on side two of the vinyl) - it fits in beautifully with the rest of the album.

Moonshine, to my mind, reeks of "trying to be fun" - in imitation of Sailors Hornpipe. Doesn't quite work, IMHO - the rest of the album is an absolute blinder, though... :D


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"I was in this prematurely air conditioned supermarket and there were these bathing caps you could buy that had these kind of Fourth of July plumes on them that were red and yellow and blue and I wasn't tempted to buy one but I was reminded of the fact that I had been avoiding the beach."
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ImAFoolAndImLaughing Offline




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Posted: Aug. 23 2007, 17:55

Quote
There's an overall 'I won't hurt you' vibe which is different from say... Amarok


And Amarok won't hurt you - it's just being friendly in a more mischievous way - harmless, really! :)


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"I was in this prematurely air conditioned supermarket and there were these bathing caps you could buy that had these kind of Fourth of July plumes on them that were red and yellow and blue and I wasn't tempted to buy one but I was reminded of the fact that I had been avoiding the beach."
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Ebony Offline




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Posted: Aug. 23 2007, 18:11

Quote (ImAFoolAndImLaughing @ Aug. 23 2007, 22:53)
Moonshine, to my mind, reeks of "trying to be fun" - in imitation of Sailors Hornpipe. Doesn't quite work, IMHO - the rest of the album is an absolute blinder, though... :D

I think it's fun.  Probably cause every time I listen I'm reminded of the live performance in Edinburgh and Mike in a cowboy hat!
Well, it amuses me anyways.
:D
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Sweetpea Offline




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Posted: Aug. 24 2007, 01:42

Quote (Ebony @ Aug. 23 2007, 17:18)
I like Moonshine.  I think it's just another example of Mike ending a serious, emotion-filled album on a lighter note, like he did with the Sailors Hornpipe on the end of TB and On Horseback on Ommadawn.

I'm all for light notes. BTW, Ebony, what is in your current MO CD collection?

Quote (ImAFoolAndImLaughing @ Aug. 23 2007, 17:53)
I'm not sure I like Sailors' Hornpipe or Moonshine - at least not in the context of the Tubular albums. On TB1, it's always seemed to be too out of place - a filler track, and whereas On Horseback was probably included on the Ommadawn LP for the same reason (i.e. to take up space on side two of the vinyl) - it fits in beautifully with the rest of the album.

I think one reason I'm partial to "Sailor's Hornpipe" and "On Horseback" is that they don't make me think of Hillbillies. And I agree that, out of all of them, "On Horseback" works the best in its context.

Quote (ImAFoolAndImLaughing @ Aug. 23 2007, 17:55)
Amarok won't hurt you - it's just being friendly in a more mischievous way

Kinda like how when a boy teases a girl, it means he likes her? *pictures Billy showing off his Aeromodeller's toolbox to Mary Jane*

Quote (Ebony @ Aug. 23 2007, 18:11)
every time I listen I'm reminded of the live performance in Edinburgh and Mike in a cowboy hat!

I don't remember that, but it's been many years since I've seen that part. Wow. That is such a strange mental image.


(currently listening to Heaven's Open)


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"I'm no physicist, but technically couldn't Mike both be with the horse and be flying through space at the same time? (On account of the earth's orbit around the Sun and all that). So it seems he never had to make the choice after all. I bet he's kicking himself now." - clotty
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CuNimb Offline




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Posted: Aug. 24 2007, 04:30

I think Mike ought to do a Tubulars Bells II 2  :D

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larstangmark Offline




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Posted: Aug. 24 2007, 07:07

If TBII was the first the first MO album I every heard, I wouldn't bother checking out his other records. Sentinel is the only thing I find attractive. To the rest of the album is really generic "look-I-can-do-all-kinds-of-music" type stuff. 90% of the music could very well be jingles to my ears.
I think the question whether TBII is a good introduction to Mike's music depends on who the person is you're trying to introduce. If you like your music a bit darker then Ommadawn is a great introduction. If you're an AOR fan then Discovery would be a good starting point. Possibly, TBII is best introduction for people who are new to music in general.
Saying that TBII is a good introduction is a bit like saying that "Invisble Touch" is a good introduction to Genesis. Or that "Give my regards to broad street" is a good introduction to the Beatles. In my opinion TBII is a very watered down version of the original, and if a person really enjoys it, I'm not so sure he/she would appreciate Hergest Ridge, even if given time.


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"There are twelve people in the world, the rest are paste"
Mark E Smith
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raven4x4x Offline




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Posted: Aug. 24 2007, 07:18

Quote (larstangmark @ Aug. 24 2007, 20:07)
In my opinion TBII is a very watered down version of the original, and if a person really enjoys it, I'm not so sure he/she would appreciate Hergest Ridge, even if given time.


I wouldn't say that Tubular Bells II and Hergest Ridge are mutually exclusive; I quite enjoy both. Tubular Bells II actually was my introduction to MO, actually it was the Edinburgh Castle performance, and for a long time it was my favourite of his albums. I also love the original TB, Amarok etc, so it certainly isn't the case that if a person loves TBII they can't love the 'proper' albums.


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Sir Mustapha Offline




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Posted: Aug. 24 2007, 08:26

Quote (larstangmark @ Aug. 24 2007, 07:07)
If TBII was the first the first MO album I every heard, I wouldn't bother checking out his other records. Sentinel is the only thing I find attractive. To the rest of the album is really generic "look-I-can-do-all-kinds-of-music" type stuff. 90% of the music could very well be jingles to my ears.

Well, maybe you won't be surprised, but I fully agree with that - and not just as a "guess", but as a certainty. One of these days, I was looking through videos of old TV programs from my country (a bit of nostalgia, you know), and I bumped into a really cheesy, really cheap advert for a computer shop, in which they announced a "Pentium 100" computer. Very cheap stuff. And guess what they were playing on the background? Yes: Dark Star. And I thought, well, I'll be damned, but the song was born to be used in places like that - because in such adverts, the music has to be cheesier than the advert itself, so the audience will pay attention on what's being sold, and not in the music.

Go ahead and rip my head off my neck, but if I ever have to do a commercial for some furniture store selling sofas and chairs, I'll keep Clear Light within reach.


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Ebony Offline




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Posted: Aug. 24 2007, 08:58

I'm actually quite curious now, so I think I'm going to make Hergest Ridge the next MO album I get, so I can see if I do like it, being the avid fan of TBII that I am.  I can't see why I wouldn't; I haven't really disliked anything of his I've heard so far.  But then because I haven't heard it, I probably wouldn't understand the reasons why I might not like it.

I am rather incensed that parts of TBII have been used as background music to cheesy adverts though.
I don't know, maybe whoever made the ad just has good taste in certain musical things  ;) , but just went about showing their appreciation in the wrong way and ended up belittling it rather than praising it!

And Sweetpea - Before I got the actual cd, and TBII was just an hour long piece of music on my computer, I actually (quite embarrassingly) referred to Moonshine as "The Hillbilly Bit", because I didn't know any of the track names apart from The Bell.
My current MO collection stands at TBI, II & III, Ommadawn, Amarok, Heaven's Open, QE2, Five Miles Out, Crises and The Songs of Distant Earth.
But I'm planning on getting them all eventually!
:)
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Alan D Offline




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Posted: Aug. 24 2007, 09:03

What's missing from these negative comments is any sense of the tremendous range of Mike Oldfield's music. To see Hergest Ridge and TB2 as somehow mutually exclusive is absurd: as absurd as saying that an appreciation of Wagner must exclude an appreciation of Haydn.

TB2 acquired a particular association for me with a long car journey that my wife and I used to do two or three times a year, driving down through Herefordshire close to the Welsh border. TB2 would go into the player, and for the duration of the album, there'd be no conversation. Both of us would be completely absorbed by the unique combination of music and landscape. (The only part that never seemed right was the horrible Moonshine bit at the end.) The music was just as riveting (and just as completely different) as Hergest Ridge (which we would sometimes play at some other part of the journey); just as worthy of our close and careful attention.
I would certainly consider it to be a contender for a good introduction to MO - but then, what aspect of MO are we talking about? It wouldn't be a good introduction to the composer of Amarok, nor to the composer of Light and Shade, or Platinum. That multi-facetedness is one of the things about MO that attracts me to his music.

The jingles argument is a bit of fun, but it is only that. ANY piece of music can be used (or should I say, abused) as a jingle, just as any great work of art can be made to seem ridiculous by presenting it unsympathetically.
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larstangmark Offline




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Posted: Aug. 24 2007, 12:28

Quote (Alan D @ Aug. 24 2007, 09:03)
What's missing from these negative comments is any sense of the tremendous range of Mike Oldfield's music. To see Hergest Ridge and TB2 as somehow mutually exclusive is absurd: as absurd as saying that an appreciation of Wagner must exclude an appreciation of Haydn.

TB2 acquired a particular association for me with a long car journey that my wife and I used to do two or three times a year, driving down through Herefordshire close to the Welsh border. TB2 would go into the player, and for the duration of the album, there'd be no conversation. Both of us would be completely absorbed by the unique combination of music and landscape. (The only part that never seemed right was the horrible Moonshine bit at the end.) The music was just as riveting (and just as completely different) as Hergest Ridge (which we would sometimes play at some other part of the journey); just as worthy of our close and careful attention.
I would certainly consider it to be a contender for a good introduction to MO - but then, what aspect of MO are we talking about? It wouldn't be a good introduction to the composer of Amarok, nor to the composer of Light and Shade, or Platinum. That multi-facetedness is one of the things about MO that attracts me to his music.

The jingles argument is a bit of fun, but it is only that. ANY piece of music can be used (or should I say, abused) as a jingle, just as any great work of art can be made to seem ridiculous by presenting it unsympathetically.

First of all I don't doubt that there are people who enjoy both TBII and HR. But I can imagine there are people who enjoy TBII who would be apalled by the almost-out-of-tune, sizzling and (first and foremost) obscure aspect of HR. TBII will definately appeal to people who like their music neat and tidy (and properly produced by Trevor Horn!). Some of the compositions are quite similiar (comparing TBII and HR), but at the same time the two albums are complete opposites.

You're right that anything could make a good jingle, but not all records sound like jingles before they're even used in an add. And that is how TBII sounds to me.

By the way, Carl Jenkins did a LP of jingles in 1976 (eventually released as "Rubber Riff" under the Soft Machine name), but the music was far too good to be used in commercials so it wasn't a success.

But I understand that people like TBII, but it's not my cup of tea at all. To me it represents the start of a phase in Mike's career that I don't enjoy at all, and I really loved most of the music that preceeds it. Although taste is a subjective thing, I think that there are more people than me who sees Mike's career this way, so chances are that prospective fans can be turned off by TBII just as much as me and Sir Mustapha.


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"There are twelve people in the world, the rest are paste"
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Sweetpea Offline




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Posted: Aug. 24 2007, 14:30

Quote (larstangmark @ Aug. 24 2007, 07:07)
I think the question whether TBII is a good introduction to Mike's music depends on who the person is you're trying to introduce. If you like your music a bit darker then Ommadawn is a great introduction. If you're an AOR fan then Discovery would be a good starting point. Possibly, TBII is best introduction for people who are new to music in general.

Of course, having foreknowledge of a listener's preference can affect one's selection, but when not equipped with that advantage, I would feel as comfortable in recommending Mike's TBII as I would in recommending Mendelssohn's 4th Symphony.

Quote (larstangmark @ Aug. 24 2007, 12:28)
But I understand that people like TBII, but it's not my cup of tea at all. To me it represents the start of a phase in Mike's career that I don't enjoy at all, and I really loved most of the music that preceeds it. Although taste is a subjective thing, I think that there are more people than me who sees Mike's career this way, so chances are that prospective fans can be turned off by TBII just as much as me and Sir Mustapha.

larstangmark, you're saying that you only like the first half of Mike's work and dislike the second half? (I fully hope that Mike's musical output continues for a good long time, so this use of 'half' is purely for the current discussion's sake). That's extremely limiting when speaking of MO's career, but it brings up the new question of what is a 'Great introduction to Early MO'?

Quote (Ebony @ Aug. 24 2007, 08:58)
I'm actually quite curious now, so I think I'm going to make Hergest Ridge the next MO album I get

It took me about six times before I got into HR and I feel it was well worth my patience.

Quote (Alan D @ Aug. 24 2007, 09:03)
I would certainly consider it to be a contender for a good introduction to MO - but then, what aspect of MO are we talking about? It wouldn't be a good introduction to the composer of Amarok, nor to the composer of Light and Shade, or Platinum. That multi-facetedness is one of the things about MO that attracts me to his music.

Yes, that's the difficulty, isn't it? As you've pointed out, Alan, Mike's "tremendous range" makes singling out an individual work as representative of his art, impossible. I like to think that exposure to any of his best pieces would hopefully lead one to explore more.


--------------
"I'm no physicist, but technically couldn't Mike both be with the horse and be flying through space at the same time? (On account of the earth's orbit around the Sun and all that). So it seems he never had to make the choice after all. I bet he's kicking himself now." - clotty
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Taurus 4 Offline




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Posted: Aug. 28 2007, 11:19

I agree with the original poster that it's a good album to "get into" Oldfield's work. It has a melodic, transcendent momentum that's vintage Mike, to my ears.

Personally if we're talking first-time recommendations then I'd go for Hergest Ridge, Ommadawn, or this. They're some of his best albums but not too intense, unlike Amarok or Incantations.
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Sweetpea Offline




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Posted: Aug. 28 2007, 16:04

Taurus 4, for me, Ommadawn is pretty intense, but I agree that it would make a good intro to MO. And welcome to the board. :)

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"I'm no physicist, but technically couldn't Mike both be with the horse and be flying through space at the same time? (On account of the earth's orbit around the Sun and all that). So it seems he never had to make the choice after all. I bet he's kicking himself now." - clotty
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Jesse Offline




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Posted: Aug. 29 2007, 07:23

I think voyager might be a great introduction..it's even more accesible than TBII
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EeToN Offline




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Posted: Aug. 29 2007, 20:18

Quote (Jesse @ Aug. 29 2007, 13:23)
I think voyager might be a great introduction..it's even more accesible than TBII

And 'Islands'. These three albums were the first ones that I actually liked after some time listening but remaining uninterested towards Mike's music. (Forgive that 10-year-old kid who was as (un)fortunate to become me now. ;))


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If I were music, I would be Enigmatism.
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Taurus 4 Offline




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Posted: Aug. 31 2007, 16:30

Thanks, Sweetpea. :)

I also agree about Voyager - that and Hergest Ridge were the only two Oldfield albums I really liked from the first listen.
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Ebony Offline




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Posted: Aug. 31 2007, 20:51

Hergest Ridge again.  I really need to get that album, I do think I'm missing a treat.

I just bought Voyager today.  Apparently my Windows Media Player has an issue with Mont St. Michel.  It won't rip it from the cd, nor will it play it.  So because I've been trying (and failing) to figure out why, I haven't actually listened to any of it yet!
I hope my cd player upstairs doesn't have the same issues.  So far I've been content just looking at all the pretty pictures in the cd booklet, but eventually I am going to want to listen to the music!  ;)

I agree with Ommadawn being a good MO introduction.  It was the first non Tubular Bells related album that I heard.
:)
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